'Wolfdogs' of unknown origin - CzW or not?

[Lorry - MLS]

Originally Posted by wolfin

this is not problematic make - i see data base and see- dogs have or not have HD ED exam, have or not have bonitation, have or not have working exams

I am really surprised about your position of ruler and judge.
Also you never incite properly more moderation in your remarks and, especially reflections and clearness on the WD’s database.

I ‘m only one simple Frenchwoman’s breeder and yet a long time ago that I noted, that the base of information, even if it is very instructive and interesting, swarming with errors, carelessness, oversight ,oblivion on all topics.

You would undoubtedly be surprised for a number of anomalies which I found on my own livestock !

1ER POINT /
I repeat it to you : it is not because the results are not indicated on the database that my dogs are not radio graphed ! .....
Exactly to the contrary !!!!

At one time, Quirinus, Vorss, Vhor' Gaal, Cyntia (just to one small example without forget the others) was noted in the base ...... but they has been removed and never admit again on the database. .....
I am not responsible and guilty for that……!!

For my side, I am really wearied to ask always corrections of errors , results of expos, error on the photographs of my dogs, their age, their sex ....... and never have received an answer (even by simple courtesy and politeness ).

I took for a certain time already to my side ,the VOLUNTARY action, to never point out the anomalies, and also the results of expos of my dogs !

(for a simple recent example ? : the results in Sweden (Word expo!) concerning my dogs are erroneous and incomplete)!!!

Also I do not take any more the trouble TO TRANSMIT the results of the hips of my dogs .....
It’s so easy , so simple for that! And that does not means that my dogs are not radio graphed!

Overall in evidence, they are the many gaps of W.D which you can observe and note that there aren’t due to an absence of control of my share ...... the nuance is of opposite size !

2EME POINT /
You speak about the Bonitation which my dogs did not pass ....

If you are a little bit much knowledge about what occurs now in France, you had to learn that all 1st Bonitation will take place this year (200 at the time of the NATIONALE D’ELEVAGE (the most important French meeting of CWS) programmed for this august ,2008.

If you talk about bonitation until now, you are in right !! Yes! it is exact!! My reproducers never passed their bonitations , ( like the major part of the French reproducer) because in France, it is not recognized as such ..... and that we do not need to pass this examination on the regulations of reproduction !

Until now, only the Confirmation on the standard level of the race is obligatory (with the TAN and the RX-displasye to approve the French Champion Titles and to allow the prestige of the dog).

I am not therefore against this stage of Bonitation and I belong of the people who spurred Mr. Imré Horvarth (the new President of the CBEI) for this 1st Bonitation in France ......

3EME POINT/
You speak about tests of work :

In France, the attack is not authorized (for CLTS) ......
The RCI, the Mondio-Ring, the are totally forbiden .....
Agility, the dog-cross, country race tracking, Obedience, (which however asks for a true daily work ) are not recognized to enrol dogs in working class.

Just the endurance test could open the door for workink class !!

If you want all to know, is for this reason that I work with my dogs in this direction, with the project to present them this and the next years in a foreign Eastern countries.
This because for this moment in France no body organize this kind of tests !!!!! (for CLTS).

What mentioned above, and moreover, the fact that in France does not have the same rules of the Eastern European countries (for example the level of Bonitation ) does not means that my dogs are the fruit of crossings as you seem to think it! .....
AND WORSE OF ALL, THIS HAS BEEN WRITTEN IN A PUBBLIC SITE !!!

Your position of judge would push you with more neutrality on a public Forum, because that manner and the language used gives your personality an painful impression......


note personnal : Like a judge, probably you are recognized as such (I cannot certify it because I never had expos with you .......)
like as human person , I found you rather arrogant and especially bluntish of your certainty ...

Greeting

Lorry de MLS

[wolfin]

hmmm, thanks from beautiful antswer. but konkrets facts i not see.
i see Your web site and not see who i wish.

but ok - i now have good humor.

[Margo]

Originally Posted by Lorry - MLS

1ER POINT /
I repeat it to you : it is not because the results are not indicated on the database that my dogs are not radio graphed ! .....
Exactly to the contrary !!!!

At one time, Quirinus, Vorss, Vhor' Gaal, Cyntia (just to one small example without forget the others) was noted in the base ...... but they has been removed and never admit again on the database. .....
I am not responsible and guilty for that……!!

I think the French admin translated it on the French forum some time ago but again:
We removed all not verified results because of some breeders which sent us false results of some dogs... So we learned not to trust breeders even if some of them call themself on this forum "serious".
If you want to have the HD of your dogs listed in the Wolfdog.org database you have to send us the copy of the official HD-results - please just scan them and send them to us...

[Margo]

Hot disscusion - I hope I will finish it...

Because of the problems with Mutaras, 'S' Passo del Lupo and some other breeders which do not understand what "purebreed dog breeding" means the Slovakian Club decided:

It will be not possible for Slovakian breeders to cover with males or register ANY dogs where there is no full pedigree till the beginn of the breed on the 80-ties.
What it means? Slovakian Club decided that the dog writen on register in Italy (LIR), France ("titre initial"), Germany (VDH R) or in any other country are considered to be not PUREBREED Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs. For example all "S" Passo del Lupo offsprings will be banned by the Slovakian Club EVEN if one of the S-Passo del Lupo dogs will be in 20, 40 or 50 generation.
We have rumors that the Czech Club will make the same steps...


Because we also think it is the only way to protect the breed we will help the people (breeders and owners) to "separate the wheat from the chaff" - in the new database ALL "register" dogs (and ALL THEIR OFFSPRINGS) will be marked red and the information will be showed that according the Slovakian CzW Club there is big doubt if the specific dog is purebreed CzW...
So if you are thinking about buying of one of the "mixes" - please think twice about it before it is too late...

[Nebelwölfe]

Originally Posted by Margo

.. in the new database ALL "register" dogs (and ALL THEIR OFFSPRINGS) will be marked red and the information will be showed that according the Slovakian CzW Club there is big doubt if the specific dog is purebreed CzW...

Even if a DNA-test can prove clearly, that the registered dog stems from purebreed parents?

Petra

[Nebulosa]

Originally Posted by littlepeet

Even if a DNA-test can prove clearly, that the registered dog stems from purebreed parents?

Petra

If a DNA exam proof that Y dog have parents with pedigree, commonly the breeder or the owner can make the pedigree of the dog.

[Nebelwölfe]

Originally Posted by Nebulosa

If a DNA exam proof that Y dog have parents with pedigree, commonly the breeder or the owner can make the pedigree of the dog.

If the owner does it, before or when the pupps are born, yes. But it is not possible later any more...

[Nebulosa]

Originally Posted by littlepeet

If the owner does it, before or when the pupps are born, yes. But it is not possible later any more...

That depend a lot of the rules of your kennel, in CBKC and some others too, this is completly possible.

[humbert]

Originally Posted by Margo

For example all "S" Passo del Lupo offsprings will be banned by the Slovakian Club EVEN if one of the S-Passo del Lupo dogs will be in 20, 40 or 50 generation.

this is surely good luck

Bye
Silvia&Gusie PDL