degenerative myelopathy in Crying Wolf

Rona · 03-10-2012, 07:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by raven

Of course I blame this breeder..in my opinion a good breeder looks for health...if you are not sure you should use a free desease, even not carrier couple for your dog...this is a good breeder, and a good breeder assumes his or her fault....and the info is not throught personal messages. He is my friend and we talk and we go for a walk with our dogs. He not uses any forum and I think is important to share this info to advise future owners, and I did it.

I'm not a fan of Crying Wolf kennel, but how can you blame the breeder if the test for DM had not been available before 2010 , the first, single dogs were tested in late 2010 and the massive testing began in 2011 when Daniela's project was introduced?

I understand the disappointment, but it's not a reason to be unfair!

michaelundinaeichhorn · 03-10-2012, 16:08

You say the dog is ill, already affected (lameness, dragging it's hindlegs and so on) or is the dog just (DM/DM) tested?
Being (DM/DM) doesn't mean the dog will suffer from this disease necessarily...
In fact the amount of (DM/DM) dogs getting affected in the end is quite small and so far nobody really knows why some dogs get it and others not.
So if the dog is not ill get yourself informed and be careful with any sort of accusations.

Michael

Ender · 03-10-2012, 20:01

I spent my last evenings reading the forum and I found plenty posts against this particular kennel. It's not my place to judge, maybe there's some truth involved, but in this case it's just an unfortunate situation. Sure, if we look at the pdf file showing DM tests, the name 'Crying Wolf' appeares a bit too often... the fact that this test wasn't available till recently is a perfectly good excuse, but from now on, it should be mandatory for all breeding dogs from certain breeds, it isn't that expensive, and it isn't that hard for any breeder to avoid producing affected puppies.

I saw a case recently...it's a terrible sight....the poor dog was barely able to move, he had to be carried everywhere, covered in his own poo most of the time (that's specific to DM)... The only thing he was able to fully control were his eyes, and that was enough for his owner to decide not to put him to sleep...

Of course, DM doesn't affect young dogs (Lord-the dog I was talking about-was almost 10 years old), if he makes his regular exercise daily, and lives in a healthy enviroment it might never be affected. Everywhere you read about it, it says that death comes when vital neural connexions are affected, but in reality if the dog cannot be supervised 24/7 all sorts of stupid accidents can happen, they simply cannot be avoided...

It's criminal from a professional breeder not to spend a few coins to make DM tests for all dogs (including old ones, to warn their offsprings' owners about possible problems). There's no excuse now, but things are still moving slow, very few dogs are DNA tested, and so it happens that you can't find a couple of breeding dogs in planned litters sections, both fully tested. Think about it, a new guy (like me) comes here to look for a puppy and sees these threads...of course next move is to look for a healthy dog rather than one coming from a good line...

How hard is to test your dogs for DM and dwarfism?

Mikael · 03-10-2012, 20:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

You say the dog is ill, already affected (lameness, dragging it's hindlegs and so on) or is the dog just (DM/DM) tested?
Being (DM/DM) doesn't mean the dog will suffer from this disease necessarily...
In fact the amount of (DM/DM) dogs getting affected in the end is quite small and so far nobody really knows why some dogs get it and others not.
So if the dog is not ill get yourself informed and be careful with any sort of accusations.

Michael

.........................

And the buyer also have the responsibility to look up and ask for health results,,,

And try also to find out who the breeder is, talk to people or look at this forum...

Some CsV is not even pure, so talk to people that knows allot / ask the club´s if you are just a little unsertain...

Look for this test or results...

DNA = DM, Dwarf
X-ray = HD and ED
MH test or breed specific tests as Bonitation Test...

Very best regards / Mikael

PS, And do not look at the dog show results, they mean from little to nothing at all, DS.

raven · 03-10-2012, 23:17

Buidelwolf...you are obstinated too..I blame not no reply to the owner that is passing throught a bad moment with that news, a good breeder would talk and reply the owner...I not want to start a witch hunt against anybody, only explain a fact that really happend....an yes...I'm a wolfdog owner if not I wouldn't be here..why are you so affected because I explain that situation? And that the breeder does anything and no answer anything to the owner?

yukidomari · 04-10-2012, 05:29

I agree and think the breeder should of course respond and help the owner at least with advice. It's the responsibility of a decent breeder even if it were not possible to screen for a problem at the time.

conan cwd · 06-10-2012, 15:24

Edit molnar is an imposter and a liar. She still owes me pedigree for my dog.She doesnt reply in e-mails and the few times she does she is lying.she was realy typical and professional until she got the money.DO NOT make business with her.

monita · 06-10-2012, 17:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by conan cwd

Edit molnar is an imposter and a liar. She still owes me pedigree for my dog.She doesnt reply in e-mails and the few times she does she is lying.she was realy typical and professional until she got the money.DO NOT make business with her.

Send me the data's of the dogs. I'll help get you the pedigree. I heard that in the last six months there wasn't any wolfdogs pedigreed.

I want your answer in e-mail so I can forward it to the Hungarian Kennel Club.

I wrote about the Hungarian pedigree here in the forums, take a look at it.

Varga István
Neckartal Kennel
Hungary

draggar · 27-12-2012, 14:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rona

I'm not a fan of Crying Wolf kennel, but how can you blame the breeder if the test for DM had not been available before 2010 , the first, single dogs were tested in late 2010 and the massive testing began in 2011 when Daniela's project was introduced?

I understand the disappointment, but it's not a reason to be unfair!

Our GSD was tested in 2009 by OFI. The breeder also knew DM was in her lines - the owners of Forrest Crying wolf became advocates for DM after Forrest fell ill - we also noted that Pollux (Pongo) was a carrier (N/dm or N/a).

Here is a video of Forrest, just a warning, it is very sad to watch it.

http://canine-dm.com/index.php?optio...d=54&Itemid=60

Mikael · 27-12-2012, 14:31

It´s not just in Crying Wolf´s lines... It´s in ALL lines...

But there is a DNA test for DM, so it is easy to breed away from it, even whit out narrowing the gene pool...

Test info >>> http://www.wolfdog-healthinfo.org/dm-4.html

Very best regards / Mikael

jmvdwiel · 28-12-2012, 18:32

here in holland we had to wait until the test was validated for the CSW before we could sent blood to the lab. I did test my dog as one of the first in februari 2010 before that date it was not possible to test a CSW in Holland.
I agree with some of the earlier commentes, don't blame breeders for having bred DM dogs in the past, BUT blame breeders who don't test their breeding stock now before they breed! And blame new owners who still takes dogs from untested parents.

draggar · 29-12-2012, 02:36

Just look at the vast majority (and I'm talking 95% +) of German shepherd breeders who just ignore it - "I don't test because it's not in my lines" (then how do you know?) or "It's not a big issue" (really? 75% of the dogs are at least carriers isn't a big issue?).

We posted Kiri's results on our website and breeders actually had the nerve to ask (well, tell / order) us to take it down. Um, no.

04-10-2012, 05:29	#6
yukidomari Moderator Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Los Angeles CA Posts: 847	I agree and think the breeder should of course respond and help the owner at least with advice. It's the responsibility of a decent breeder even if it were not possible to screen for a problem at the time. __________________ "Learn to do well; seek judgment." www.greyfarer.com/

27-12-2012, 14:31	#10
Mikael Scandinavian Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Stockholm Posts: 1,089	It´s not just in Crying Wolf´s lines... It´s in ALL lines... But there is a DNA test for DM, so it is easy to breed away from it, even whit out narrowing the gene pool... Test info >>> http://www.wolfdog-healthinfo.org/dm-4.html Very best regards / Mikael __________________ _________________________________________________ Hronec, Rasty, Zilja Kennel, Wolfdog of Sweden* http://kennelwolfdogofsweden.vpsite.se/Home.html http://www.facebook.com/pages/Wolfdo...53067971392916

29-12-2012, 02:36	#12
draggar Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 370	Just look at the vast majority (and I'm talking 95% +) of German shepherd breeders who just ignore it - "I don't test because it's not in my lines" (then how do you know?) or "It's not a big issue" (really? 75% of the dogs are at least carriers isn't a big issue?). We posted Kiri's results on our website and breeders actually had the nerve to ask (well, tell / order) us to take it down. Um, no. __________________ Fred Lanting's Official Site Dog Actors

03-10-2012, 16:08	#2
michaelundinaeichhorn Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Bad Dürkheim Posts: 2,249	You say the dog is ill, already affected (lameness, dragging it's hindlegs and so on) or is the dog just (DM/DM) tested? Being (DM/DM) doesn't mean the dog will suffer from this disease necessarily... In fact the amount of (DM/DM) dogs getting affected in the end is quite small and so far nobody really knows why some dogs get it and others not. So if the dog is not ill get yourself informed and be careful with any sort of accusations. Michael

03-10-2012, 20:01	#3
Ender Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 2	I spent my last evenings reading the forum and I found plenty posts against this particular kennel. It's not my place to judge, maybe there's some truth involved, but in this case it's just an unfortunate situation. Sure, if we look at the pdf file showing DM tests, the name 'Crying Wolf' appeares a bit too often... the fact that this test wasn't available till recently is a perfectly good excuse, but from now on, it should be mandatory for all breeding dogs from certain breeds, it isn't that expensive, and it isn't that hard for any breeder to avoid producing affected puppies. I saw a case recently...it's a terrible sight....the poor dog was barely able to move, he had to be carried everywhere, covered in his own poo most of the time (that's specific to DM)... The only thing he was able to fully control were his eyes, and that was enough for his owner to decide not to put him to sleep... Of course, DM doesn't affect young dogs (Lord-the dog I was talking about-was almost 10 years old), if he makes his regular exercise daily, and lives in a healthy enviroment it might never be affected. Everywhere you read about it, it says that death comes when vital neural connexions are affected, but in reality if the dog cannot be supervised 24/7 all sorts of stupid accidents can happen, they simply cannot be avoided... It's criminal from a professional breeder not to spend a few coins to make DM tests for all dogs (including old ones, to warn their offsprings' owners about possible problems). There's no excuse now, but things are still moving slow, very few dogs are DNA tested, and so it happens that you can't find a couple of breeding dogs in planned litters sections, both fully tested. Think about it, a new guy (like me) comes here to look for a puppy and sees these threads...of course next move is to look for a healthy dog rather than one coming from a good line... How hard is to test your dogs for DM and dwarfism?

03-10-2012, 23:17	#5
raven Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 21	Buidelwolf...you are obstinated too..I blame not no reply to the owner that is passing throught a bad moment with that news, a good breeder would talk and reply the owner...I not want to start a witch hunt against anybody, only explain a fact that really happend....an yes...I'm a wolfdog owner if not I wouldn't be here..why are you so affected because I explain that situation? And that the breeder does anything and no answer anything to the owner?

06-10-2012, 15:24	#7
conan cwd Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 2	Edit molnar is an imposter and a liar. She still owes me pedigree for my dog.She doesnt reply in e-mails and the few times she does she is lying.she was realy typical and professional until she got the money.DO NOT make business with her.

28-12-2012, 18:32	#11
jmvdwiel Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 1,061	here in holland we had to wait until the test was validated for the CSW before we could sent blood to the lab. I did test my dog as one of the first in februari 2010 before that date it was not possible to test a CSW in Holland. I agree with some of the earlier commentes, don't blame breeders for having bred DM dogs in the past, BUT blame breeders who don't test their breeding stock now before they breed! And blame new owners who still takes dogs from untested parents.