Feeding for Ultimate Health...

Gypsy Wolf · 23-04-2010, 21:28

Interesting tidbits. I have a friend who swears by olive oil in the diet, too. There are some folks who also ascribe to "regional" diets - i.e. feeding Scottish breeds oats and mutton which they would've eaten as they were developed in their country of origin.
Luna has noshed on soup bones and today had her first chicken necks. She tore into them. I have no issue using some raw stuff to supplement from time to time - I am paranoid about "gaps" as I think that there is no way kibble forever totally meets every dog's every need. Whole foods do help assimilate trace vitamins/minerals - things like C break down quickly in prepared foods.
Having studied coyotes in the wild myself, they are very omnivorous whether or not they can digest fruits well or not, they certainly do eat them. Coyotes are the bane of watermelon farmers in NJ! They are known to raid a patch and leave a horrible mess.
The coyotes living in urban areas, like the ones in NYC's Central Park, are fascinating - to me, that's likely how dogs domesticated themselves...

soniakanavle · 24-04-2010, 01:36

Hey Lunas Mom. I feed a high quality kibble, lamb & rice or venison & rice [Canidae or taste of the wild usually] and mix in at times cooked brown rice, canned pumpkin, teaspoon of olive oil, nutritional yeast, yogurt or a scrambled egg. He'll eat just dry kibble but I think that must get boring day after day so I try to mix it up.
My boyfriend and I are both vegetarians so we never have meat in our fridge but I'll get him a meat treat from time to time since he does love it! [He ate a whole ham once!]
I don't use many supplements for my CsV.. I did more for my GSD [MSN/Glucosemine/Missing Link etc.] I have used Psyllium seed husk, a powder called 'K9 immune dog' and salmon oil from time to time but Flint seems perfectly healthy, great coat, great movement, happy and healthy on his diet alone.
I still give him bones to chew but never rawhides. They gave him very bad diarrhea and he ate them so fast I was worried about intestinal/throat blockage.
His favorite treat though are fruits and veggies! He LOVES tomatos, baby carrots, spinach, olives, apples, watermelon, blackberries, pickles etc.!!

yukidomari · 24-04-2010, 05:29

For those that think dogs can benefit off vegetables & fruits, there is BARF model (contrast to prey model), too. Lots of choices.

Unlike cats which are obligate carnivores, dogs are pretty much opportunistic carnivores. They'll eat most anything they can get their paws on, but their bodies are still built optimally for meat. From time to time the dogs get veggies & fruits here too.. but as a recreational treat, not as a main part of their diet.

Silvester · 24-04-2010, 09:15

Originally posted by yukidomari :

"Unlike cats which are obligate carnivores, dogs are pretty much opportunistic carnivores. They'll eat most anything they can get their paws on, but their bodies are still built optimally for meat. From time to time the dogs get veggies & fruits here too.. but as a recreational treat, not as a main part of their diet.

"

Yeah, that´s again exactly the point ... !

You need only have a look at the teeth of cat compared to dogs and you see the difference - cats are much more specialized in being carnivores.

Or for example take bears - and compete the teeth of a brown bear to those of a polar bear. You can notice easily that polar bear is highly specialized meat- eater and in the opposite brown bear are much more omnivorus.

The last molar teeth in the jaws of dogs have also a form to enable them to consume vegetables too.
But the rest of teeth are all those of a typical carnivorus animal.

Nice weekend to everyone here !

Vaiva · 16-05-2010, 19:14

I see a lot of you mix dry food and meat

But this can cause a gastritis for your dog. Just for digesting raw meat a stomatch has to be much more "sour" than for the dry food. I feed Brukne only raw bony meat, organs, sea fish since she was 5 months and i am really happy about this kind of feeding (especially when I have to pick her poo when walking

), she also sometimes gets a mixture of curd, kefir, raw egg, some oil (linseed or olive) and honey

At the moment my freezer is full of... boar

Brukne is happy

pdmcgrane · 16-05-2010, 20:14

Just curious- how much food should a 5-6month old Vlcak get? I feed the recommended amount, but it seems that my puppy still remains on the skinnier side- although it seems that this breed is more of a skinny/lanky breed in puppyhood (more so than other dog breeds). Currently I'm feeding her a raw food (meat, bones and organs) and de-hydrated raw food diet along with vitamins. How much weight a week should she be gaining during this period? What month in her life will see the greatest weight gain? How much should a female Vlcak weigh when she's 5-6 months old? I'd appreciate everyone's advice!

Vaiva · 16-05-2010, 21:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdmcgrane

Just curious- how much food should a 5-6month old Vlcak get? I feed the recommended amount, but it seems that my puppy still remains on the skinnier side- although it seems that this breed is more of a skinny/lanky breed in puppyhood (more so than other dog breeds). Currently I'm feeding her a raw food (meat, bones and organs) and de-hydrated raw food diet along with vitamins. How much weight a week should she be gaining during this period? What month in her life will see the greatest weight gain? How much should a female Vlcak weigh when she's 5-6 months old? I'd appreciate everyone's advice!

Well, a skiny dog is always better than a fat one. Have you tried not measuring the food - just giving the amount a young dog wants to eat? If he has a sense of "enought" (mine doesn't), this could be the answer

I am speaking about raw meat diet in this case.

Pavel · 18-05-2010, 09:52

Its very funny (and sad same time) to read this discussion. Lunas Mom ask about the best feeding and when get a answer, that best one is raw, then argumentate, why is it not true.
I feeding my all dogs (CsW only) only raw and I dont see any problem. And raw get by me just puppy about 3 weeks old. I never used industrial produced food. My oldest - Nancy have just 13 years and no problems.
For info, my dogs eating
1. Full chicken (means really full, incl feathers, head, legs etc.)
2. Ostrich stomachs, heads and feets (some time whole ostrich)
3. Raw eggs, vegetable and fruits
4. Some times rests from kitchen as well

yukidomari · 18-05-2010, 17:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdmcgrane

Just curious- how much food should a 5-6month old Vlcak get? I feed the recommended amount, but it seems that my puppy still remains on the skinnier side- although it seems that this breed is more of a skinny/lanky breed in puppyhood (more so than other dog breeds). Currently I'm feeding her a raw food (meat, bones and organs) and de-hydrated raw food diet along with vitamins. How much weight a week should she be gaining during this period? What month in her life will see the greatest weight gain? How much should a female Vlcak weigh when she's 5-6 months old? I'd appreciate everyone's advice!

In our raw feeding circles the general rule of thumb for feeding puppies is to feed 2-3% by weight of the projected ADULT weight. And adjust accordingly to individuals. Not having had a Vlcak yet, I can't tell you what the adult weight really should be, but even if I had one, all dogs are different. The correct and optimal weight for any dog of any breed is one where you can feel their ribs ever so slightly when you touch their sides without pushing much at all. Lots of breeds have the 'lanky ugly puppy stage'... way too much legs without an adult coat yet, makes for a funny looking dog.

In my experience with other breeds in general though, pups usually grow up first and then outwards, some taking up to 2 years to fill out completely.

24-04-2010, 05:29	#3
yukidomari Moderator Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Los Angeles CA Posts: 847	For those that think dogs can benefit off vegetables & fruits, there is BARF model (contrast to prey model), too. Lots of choices. Unlike cats which are obligate carnivores, dogs are pretty much opportunistic carnivores. They'll eat most anything they can get their paws on, but their bodies are still built optimally for meat. From time to time the dogs get veggies & fruits here too.. but as a recreational treat, not as a main part of their diet. Last edited by yukidomari; 24-04-2010 at 05:32.

16-05-2010, 19:14	#5
Vaiva ir Brukne Join Date: May 2006 Location: Vilnius Posts: 1,768	I see a lot of you mix dry food and meat But this can cause a gastritis for your dog. Just for digesting raw meat a stomatch has to be much more "sour" than for the dry food. I feed Brukne only raw bony meat, organs, sea fish since she was 5 months and i am really happy about this kind of feeding (especially when I have to pick her poo when walking ), she also sometimes gets a mixture of curd, kefir, raw egg, some oil (linseed or olive) and honey At the moment my freezer is full of... boar Brukne is happy __________________ Walkiria Girios dvasia

23-04-2010, 21:28	#1
Gypsy Wolf Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Florida & Minnesota U.S. Posts: 252	Interesting tidbits. I have a friend who swears by olive oil in the diet, too. There are some folks who also ascribe to "regional" diets - i.e. feeding Scottish breeds oats and mutton which they would've eaten as they were developed in their country of origin. Luna has noshed on soup bones and today had her first chicken necks. She tore into them. I have no issue using some raw stuff to supplement from time to time - I am paranoid about "gaps" as I think that there is no way kibble forever totally meets every dog's every need. Whole foods do help assimilate trace vitamins/minerals - things like C break down quickly in prepared foods. Having studied coyotes in the wild myself, they are very omnivorous whether or not they can digest fruits well or not, they certainly do eat them. Coyotes are the bane of watermelon farmers in NJ! They are known to raid a patch and leave a horrible mess. The coyotes living in urban areas, like the ones in NYC's Central Park, are fascinating - to me, that's likely how dogs domesticated themselves...

24-04-2010, 01:36	#2
soniakanavle Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Blanco, Texas Posts: 81	Hey Lunas Mom. I feed a high quality kibble, lamb & rice or venison & rice [Canidae or taste of the wild usually] and mix in at times cooked brown rice, canned pumpkin, teaspoon of olive oil, nutritional yeast, yogurt or a scrambled egg. He'll eat just dry kibble but I think that must get boring day after day so I try to mix it up. My boyfriend and I are both vegetarians so we never have meat in our fridge but I'll get him a meat treat from time to time since he does love it! [He ate a whole ham once!] I don't use many supplements for my CsV.. I did more for my GSD [MSN/Glucosemine/Missing Link etc.] I have used Psyllium seed husk, a powder called 'K9 immune dog' and salmon oil from time to time but Flint seems perfectly healthy, great coat, great movement, happy and healthy on his diet alone. I still give him bones to chew but never rawhides. They gave him very bad diarrhea and he ate them so fast I was worried about intestinal/throat blockage. His favorite treat though are fruits and veggies! He LOVES tomatos, baby carrots, spinach, olives, apples, watermelon, blackberries, pickles etc.!!

24-04-2010, 09:15	#4
Silvester Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 369	Originally posted by yukidomari : "Unlike cats which are obligate carnivores, dogs are pretty much opportunistic carnivores. They'll eat most anything they can get their paws on, but their bodies are still built optimally for meat. From time to time the dogs get veggies & fruits here too.. but as a recreational treat, not as a main part of their diet. " Yeah, that´s again exactly the point ... ! You need only have a look at the teeth of cat compared to dogs and you see the difference - cats are much more specialized in being carnivores. Or for example take bears - and compete the teeth of a brown bear to those of a polar bear. You can notice easily that polar bear is highly specialized meat- eater and in the opposite brown bear are much more omnivorus. The last molar teeth in the jaws of dogs have also a form to enable them to consume vegetables too. But the rest of teeth are all those of a typical carnivorus animal. Nice weekend to everyone here !

16-05-2010, 20:14	#6
pdmcgrane Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Colorado Posts: 12	Just curious- how much food should a 5-6month old Vlcak get? I feed the recommended amount, but it seems that my puppy still remains on the skinnier side- although it seems that this breed is more of a skinny/lanky breed in puppyhood (more so than other dog breeds). Currently I'm feeding her a raw food (meat, bones and organs) and de-hydrated raw food diet along with vitamins. How much weight a week should she be gaining during this period? What month in her life will see the greatest weight gain? How much should a female Vlcak weigh when she's 5-6 months old? I'd appreciate everyone's advice!

18-05-2010, 09:52	#8
Pavel Moderator Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 2,190	Its very funny (and sad same time) to read this discussion. Lunas Mom ask about the best feeding and when get a answer, that best one is raw, then argumentate, why is it not true. I feeding my all dogs (CsW only) only raw and I dont see any problem. And raw get by me just puppy about 3 weeks old. I never used industrial produced food. My oldest - Nancy have just 13 years and no problems. For info, my dogs eating 1. Full chicken (means really full, incl feathers, head, legs etc.) 2. Ostrich stomachs, heads and feets (some time whole ostrich) 3. Raw eggs, vegetable and fruits 4. Some times rests from kitchen as well