AKC lowering registration numbers for full recognition from FSS?

[GalomyOak]

Yep - when I first registered Anthea and Roni, I asked some questions to the AKC about a few things...and was told mine were the only ones registered. So...my 4 adults and 4 puppies are the only ones (for now, I think) registered, unless someone else has since registered.

Is there a way to encourage CsV owners in the US to register their dogs? Even if they're just pets, they'd help the cause as it were. I think it'd be something for breeders selling pups to the US, to encourage AKC registration!

[draggar]

Originally Posted by Vicky

Is there a way to encourage CsV owners in the US to register their dogs? Even if they're just pets, they'd help the cause as it were. I think it'd be something for breeders selling pups to the US, to encourage AKC registration!

That will bring up the age old "quality vs. quantity" debate. I'm sure the quality now is still very high considering the low numbers and control the ethical people have over the breed.

Don't breeders usually register their litters with the AKC?

I also spoke to Fred Lanting about being a vlcak judge in UKC - did he contact you Marcy? He might be a little "gruff" - don't let that scare you, he really is a nice guy.

How many vlcaks are registered with the UKC here in the USA?

Originally Posted by draggar

That will bring up the age old "quality vs. quantity" debate. I'm sure the quality now is still very high considering the low numbers and control the ethical people have over the breed.

If you're going to bring that up in regards to registration, why not bring up the "work vs. show" debate as well? The thing of it is, the AKC is and always will be just a registry. However, it brings with it a lot of validity in the public eye to a breed. It's up to the (future) national breed club to set standards for breeding and where the breed is headed. Honestly, I'm a bit torn in regards to registration just because of the fact you mentioned and the fact that AKC registration draws a lot of the "show" crowd. However, with a breed that is so controversial in a lot of minds, I think full AKC registration should be a goal and at this point in time (i.e. before full registration, with a limited amount of breeders allowing their dogs into the US) the more registration the better until the numbers are up. I mean, chances are good that the dogs being imported are being registered with the FCI anyway, all you would need (if I remember right) is the dog to be in any foreign registry along with at least a 3 generation pedigree, so it shouldn't take too much work (as I understand it) to get an imported dog registered. Marcy, if I'm off, you can correct me.


hahaha I know I'm going back & forth on the subject, but the more I'm writing this out and thinking about it, now, I guess the more important thing than registration would be the forming of a breed club. Maybe more than encouraging people to register with the AKC, breeders should encourage owners to come here and network with OTHER owners in the US! See, it helps to think things out!

[draggar]

Show vs. work - you bring up a great question. Many breeds you can tell just by looking show dogs vs. working dogs. =IMO it's sad to see dogs just bred for beauty (I think the GSD breed has been damaged so much I consider it abuse in many cases).

Maybe the CsVCA should incorperate into the charter working ability / ethic? It's up to the CsVCA to define the standard (not AKC) and promote working ability. I hear too often from people "well, I'm no one to change the standard so why argue the point?". Well, we ARE the CsVCA and the future of it (Marcy, Vicky, myself, and our partners in crime).

Marcy has put up a site for the club already:
http://www.czechoslovakianvlcak.org/

I think it's time to make the club official. I'm not sure about the registration process (registering it as a not for profit organization, etc.) but maybe we could tap my wife (Sara) about this - she's formed a club before (DOTE) so we can check with her to see what is involved as well as the costs (I don't know if DOTE was just for the state (FL) or national, though). If the costs are too high, then we can wait but we should get it done before someone else jumps in and does it (I think this happened to the shiloh shepherd community and look at what's going on with them now).

I know more costs = we'd have to charge dues but we could charge just enough to cover costs - maybe a little extra for other equipment we may need (meet the breed booth at Eukanuba, funds for rescue, etc..).

I think Marcy has an email list of the vlcak owners in the US (from the rescue email you sent out the other day - did you hear anything back from that?). Maybe we should get them involved and maybe even get a forum up for CsVCA (on Marcy's site?). While vBulliten is very nice (what this site uses) it is expensive - $195 a year for the basic package, $285 for the delux (includes a blog, CMS etc..), there are free options (I've been using SMF on a lot of my sites and it is very nice - not as much is included as vBulliten but it's very good for a free one). I could run the forum if needed.

I've also debating registering vlcakrescue.com before a squatter gets it (I may just go ahead with that today anyway). I know there is no serious need for a site now but I could point it to the csvca site.

Edit: I just registered vlcakrescue.com and vlcakrescue.org (.org domains seem to be more "legit" with uses like this so I'm sure a lot of people will type that in, too).

[GalomyOak]

To try to answer a few questions, in no particular order...

Vicky - I am pretty sure some of the current owners will register their dogs in time. For others, it's a personal choice not too - there are many reasons out there. I respect the personal decisions of others in this situation, even if it means waiting a bit longer. Thus far, we have been quite blessed in the owners that are in the US, minus one or two...really good folks, with good intentions. Our breed will always be controversial, until some kind of "hero" story comes out - and then they will become popular, and trouble will start. Haha - I was approached in January by a casting agent for Animal Planet to be on some documentary about UKC show dogs (Show Pooches) - but had to kindly decline: I am fiercely private, and generally humble - but also didn't want that kind of exposure for the breed at this junction. For the casual investigator (such as the dog warden that showed up at my house, when my hillbilly neighbor - whose GSDs had attacked my dogs while I had them on lead in the road - reported that I was breeding hybrids - after I reported his dogs), the FSS papers with their big AKC logo is usually plenty. He told me they were the coolest thing he'd ever seen, and good luck with the breeding - and gave my neighbor an official warning.

Ed - Breeders in Europe register their litters through country breed clubs, associated with the FCI. The puppy in your home is from the first US litter, it is registered with the AKC/FSS. I can't speak for other upcoming breeders here, but assume they will register their litters. Establishing a club involves having active, willing participants. We have a limited number of households that have been ready to jump in, the tide is slowly turning. In the correspondance I have had with people, many were not at a point where they wanted to be in a club involved with AKC politics, governing body, dues, etc., and more preferred an informal group of sorts. Certainly don't think they would be interested in being bossed around by a few gung-ho people like us, and wouldn't want to - they are also people I consider good friends. Without those members, we are a pretty tiny group...I think we risk more by alienating owners at this point. We don't have any costs right now, other than the website - that is taken care of for at least 2 years by a great owner in LA and me, if someone would like to contribute a blog, I'd certainly be fine with attempting to add that. As far as I know, the same 8 dogs registered with the AKC are the only ones registered with UKC - mine are the only ones that appear in the Top 10, anyways. When I revised the standard with Kathy Lorentzen in 2008, they were the only ones showing. I'm dealing with some pretty heavy personal stuff at the moment, so even I will be/have been a bit "distracted" for a little while with regards to the club...really looking forward to July though! I did hear from Fred Lanting, still need to respond - as I said, a lot going on. I really respect his work, and think it is awesome he is on board.

I would entirely be for establishing a voting system, and making some decisions on code of ethics, etc. I have gotten a ton of responses to my email (some of those are husband/wife seperate accounts, 3 disconnected accounts, and also owners in Canada that are interested in our development, as well - so the numbers aren't too huge.) Will respond this weekend.

Happy Friday!
Marcy

[soniakanavle]

Hello, I have some questions regarding registration...

I live in the US and I have a five year old male CsV [Loki von Wolfen] that I would like to register with the AKC/FSS and UKC [I could add 1 number to the list! ] but I have a problem which, apparenty, is I imported him from Canada, not Europe and since the Canadian Kennel Club doesn't accept our CsV as a breed yet, [and I've heard has no intention to do so anytime soon] I'm not able to submit a three generation pedigree/registration number since the CKC is the only registry in Canada that both the AKC/UKC accept. I wrote to the breeder in Quebec, and he said he gave up on the CKC and is hoping to register the litter [finally] with the 'Canine Federation of Canada' [CFC] which so far only has five breeds on its list, though he said they are adding 17 more this year, CsV included. It is not affiliated with the CKC or the FCI though and I have no idea if the AKC will accept it as a worthy foreign registry....

Another thing I see being a hurdle is I only co-own my dog, with the co-owner being the breeder in Quebec. Can I register a dog in the US when it is still technically co-owned by a foreigner??

Anyone know anything about any of this?? Any help would be appreciated since if I'm going to help out with a US breed club I'd like to have a legal canine citizen!!

Thanks! ~Sonia and Loki