HD evaluation according the FCI rules

jasmine · 05-01-2010, 20:17

?????
we have a complex examination,not just measuring
(but I wrote it several times,moreover your breeder has some certification from me)

Nebulosa · 05-01-2010, 23:42

Normally the certifications don't have the X rays, and even when it have its too small, so the certifications will make no diference, as the diference is in the evaluation of the X-ray and the attention to some small things.
I found something that can show a little bit of the problem in internet even if its really dificult to show, principaly when the majority dont work or are involved with veterinary medicine.

Like, for have A we must have perfect femoral head, congruent and the most equal possible in both sides...

Its a hungarian x ray of viszla with A results by the webpage of the UK club.
Here the x ray, its big

And an A dog used as exemple, its only for see one A the femoral head and about how it should look like, of course we have some differences dog by dog, breed by breed.
The femoral head format is something that must be also evaluate.

But its only a photo we cant judge well by it, but even looking here you already can see the diferences and see that something isn't well.

michaelundinaeichhorn · 06-01-2010, 00:19

Sorry, but the viszla-x-ray shouldn´t be used as an example because 1. it is a x-ray of bad quality and 2. the placement of the hip and legs isn´t 100% correct and the knees are missing on the x-ray. It is possible that this dog will be judged correctly as A when it is placed in a proper way.

And hips of different breeds look different what is the reason why the German HD-judges don´t judge all breeds in general, all dogs of one breed are judged by one or two of the experts.

Ina

Nebulosa · 06-01-2010, 00:34

This X ray shoudn't be used, but it was as official.

For what I saw I really dont believe it will be A even in right position.
I had a nice collection of "different hips results in imported addult dogs" when I have free time I will try to pick it back.

jasmine · 06-01-2010, 19:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nebulosa

This X ray shoudn't be used, but it was as official.

For what I saw I really dont believe it will be A even in right position.
I had a nice collection of "different hips results in imported addult dogs" when I have free time I will try to pick it back.

Than put the hungarian official certification about the vizsla x-ray as well, not just a bad quality x-ray.....because from this we don't know what was the results......

Anyway: it is surely not official. The official x-ray must use tatoo number or chipnumber of the dog, LEFT downcorner of the x-ray, and nothing else. It is a rule.

And when some owners won't bring their dogs to Poland for better results, than you could critisize of our protocol. But just than!!!!!!

Nebulosa · 06-01-2010, 21:07

The knees are missing the X rays as probably the datas of the dog also because it was clearly cropped out with photoshop, they wanted show the hips not whole X ray.
Its not me who're saying it was exemple of hungrian X ray, but the proper club

But its only one internet exemple of the problem, wich we can proof day by day with the imported dogs.

And no, I didn't had sended the X rays of my dog to poland for better results, if I would do this I would not sent him to the vet I sended as I would not sent it to poland.

But as you make question to know why do I sent it to Poland, at the time of sent back the results our club mistaken the breed at the cadastre (well, we had no CzW before) and sended it to GSD club instead of my house, it took about 6 months for I be able to know after where are my results, I really didn't had time for more breed cadastre mistake in the sent back, so I decide to make the results in both countries.
As I knew in Poland have one very reliable vet I solve to sent his X rays for him.

But dont worrie, I'm very different of you as I really care for the hips of my dogs and its selection, maybe I will sent the next results of my dogs to OFFA as well, as "the same results in 2 different countries dont count", lets put the tird one.

But you should really see about make the results also in other place to confirm the hungarian results of your dogs, as it seems your breeding have problems with hips, principally when the dogs get X rayed outside your country, as you should respect a little bit what the results say, use both C dogs in breeding is not wise nor what we can call selection.

Hanka · 07-01-2010, 08:16

A little of topic:
Everybody can send official foto to our czech club doctors, for czech HD, ED results. We have a few doctors for it, but usually owners use only two.
The doctors must make protocol A4 format with all measuring.
If somebody want do it, he can contact me for more info.

05-01-2010, 23:42	#2
Nebulosa Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Rio Grande do Sul Posts: 1,334	Normally the certifications don't have the X rays, and even when it have its too small, so the certifications will make no diference, as the diference is in the evaluation of the X-ray and the attention to some small things. I found something that can show a little bit of the problem in internet even if its really dificult to show, principaly when the majority dont work or are involved with veterinary medicine. Like, for have A we must have perfect femoral head, congruent and the most equal possible in both sides... Its a hungarian x ray of viszla with A results by the webpage of the UK club. Here the x ray, its big And an A dog used as exemple, its only for see one A the femoral head and about how it should look like, of course we have some differences dog by dog, breed by breed. The femoral head format is something that must be also evaluate. But its only a photo we cant judge well by it, but even looking here you already can see the diferences and see that something isn't well. __________________

06-01-2010, 00:34	#4
Nebulosa Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Rio Grande do Sul Posts: 1,334	This X ray shoudn't be used, but it was as official. For what I saw I really dont believe it will be A even in right position. I had a nice collection of "different hips results in imported addult dogs" when I have free time I will try to pick it back. __________________

06-01-2010, 21:07	#6
Nebulosa Moderator Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Rio Grande do Sul Posts: 1,334	The knees are missing the X rays as probably the datas of the dog also because it was clearly cropped out with photoshop, they wanted show the hips not whole X ray. Its not me who're saying it was exemple of hungrian X ray, but the proper club But its only one internet exemple of the problem, wich we can proof day by day with the imported dogs. And no, I didn't had sended the X rays of my dog to poland for better results, if I would do this I would not sent him to the vet I sended as I would not sent it to poland. But as you make question to know why do I sent it to Poland, at the time of sent back the results our club mistaken the breed at the cadastre (well, we had no CzW before) and sended it to GSD club instead of my house, it took about 6 months for I be able to know after where are my results, I really didn't had time for more breed cadastre mistake in the sent back, so I decide to make the results in both countries. As I knew in Poland have one very reliable vet I solve to sent his X rays for him. But dont worrie, I'm very different of you as I really care for the hips of my dogs and its selection, maybe I will sent the next results of my dogs to OFFA as well, as "the same results in 2 different countries dont count", lets put the tird one. But you should really see about make the results also in other place to confirm the hungarian results of your dogs, as it seems your breeding have problems with hips, principally when the dogs get X rayed outside your country, as you should respect a little bit what the results say, use both C dogs in breeding is not wise nor what we can call selection. __________________ Last edited by Nebulosa; 06-01-2010 at 21:21.

05-01-2010, 20:17	#1
jasmine Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 188	????? we have a complex examination,not just measuring (but I wrote it several times,moreover your breeder has some certification from me)

06-01-2010, 00:19	#3
michaelundinaeichhorn Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Bad Dürkheim Posts: 2,249	Sorry, but the viszla-x-ray shouldn´t be used as an example because 1. it is a x-ray of bad quality and 2. the placement of the hip and legs isn´t 100% correct and the knees are missing on the x-ray. It is possible that this dog will be judged correctly as A when it is placed in a proper way. And hips of different breeds look different what is the reason why the German HD-judges don´t judge all breeds in general, all dogs of one breed are judged by one or two of the experts. Ina

07-01-2010, 08:16	#7
Hanka Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Kadaň Posts: 1,622	A little of topic: Everybody can send official foto to our czech club doctors, for czech HD, ED results. We have a few doctors for it, but usually owners use only two. The doctors must make protocol A4 format with all measuring. If somebody want do it, he can contact me for more info.