'Just for fun' bonitation in Osieczna (PL)

[z Peronówki]

Originally Posted by Monika

Nebulosa, nobody sais that bonitacion was under Czech Club! But according to Czech rules, yes - judgement of exterier, measurement, character test, shooting. The results are accepted Czech Club like others strange bonitacion.... Italien, Belgian, German, France for example - only info more about dogs from countries where the breeders do not need it for breeding! Everybody can be organizators bonitacion and they DON´T NEED REQUEST FOR PERMISSION CZECH CLUB!

Nebulosa - what Monika is trying to explain to you: you do not need ANY rules.. Invite your friend who is a FCI judge for a grill party or a beer and make a bonitation. Make some measurements, shoot two times, and make some kind of character test... And the Czech Club will accpept it... If you will invite two other friends to the comittee it will be much more professional than the bonitation in Osieczna...


Sorry Monika but in this case the bonitations are no more needed in this breed because they are for NOTHING. If anyone can make ANY kind of bonitation according ANY rules and it will be accepted as VALID bonitation than why ANY club should invite you or any of the club judges? They don't need you... They can use any judge and make the bonitation according their own rules - prepare their own cards, and own regulation. Nobody must accept it, everybody can make measurements....

Sorry but you are starting again a new PARODY inside this breed... After registration of pseudo-wolfdogs and pseudo-club now you promoting pseudo-bonitation....

[Monika]

The bonitacion in Osiezna is on same level for Czech Club, like bonitacion in Pózno, for example for better understanding.

I not understand well Margo ´s " brainwashing " but this is normal for me.

Bonitacion in Osiezna was made by Czech Judge and keep Czech rules.

Margo is last person, who can to say if the bonitacion valid or not.

Strangres bonitacion for Czech club not are valid for memebers of Czech Club, only. The member of Czech Club can pass bonitacion in Osiezna :0) Pózno or Serramazzoni but this bonitacion isn´ t enough for czech breeding!
Czech owner must to pass for breeding Czech KCHCSV bonitacion, only!


And strangers NOT NEED this FOR BREEDING! This acction is OPTIONAL!
You go with your dogs on bonitacion when you want, only and when you think, he can pass well it.... And you breed CSWs without bonitacion, too!

SO what happened Margo, somebody took the toys?

I know the rules and my rights very well.

Who goes those rules you only .. you have no right to say that bonitacion are valid and the dog is good stud dog, or not!
Everyone can read, knows where the bonitacion done and by whom. There are also videos. Just make a valid entry, and without comment, if you want to inform correctly.
Bonitace can be never exactly the same. The conditions are different, Judge, rules and helper .. implementation. Slovak temperament test is another test ... Italy is different too....But this is not problem, for me surely.
Please let to say the Judge his opinion.
Everyone can read and knows where and by whom was the bonitacion done this is same like different HD results!

We can read and nobody need your explanation! Thanks!

Monika

[z Peronówki]

Originally Posted by Monika

Strangres bonitacion for Czech club not are valid for memebers of Czech Club, only. The member of Czech Club can pass bonitacion in Osiezna :0) Pózno or Serramazzoni but this bonitacion isn´ t enough for czech breeding!

I know - and I understand their possition in 100%!!!! They were simply affraid that owners of all the untypical, shy, too small dogs will travel abroad and take part in such PSEUDO-bonitation which you promote...

I understand that they don't want accept the results of Italian male and female who are EXTREMLY SHY but on the PSEUDO-bonitations made by you or with you the dogs get THE PERFECT character codes.

I understand that they don't want accept the results of dog which you measured 65cm, and who is in the reality 61-62 cm height...

Do you wonder that the Czech club do not want to accept other bonitation when there are more and more examples where a dog who will be in Czech Republic disqualified (P14) get by you or by your friends PERFECT bonitation code...

The same is with Wolfdog - in the database are more results 'recognized' - all the bonitations must fulfill are: they must be done according the valid bonitation regulations (Czech or Slovakian). Because of it the bonitation in Germany, Lithuania, Poland, France, Holland and some in Italy are considered as valid....

Pseudo-party-bonitation made according non-existing regulations are considered as "bonitation for fun" and are not listed...

[z Peronówki]

Originally Posted by Monika

And strangers NOT NEED this FOR BREEDING! This acction is OPTIONAL!
You go with your dogs on bonitacion when you want, only and when you think, he can pass well it.... And you breed CSWs without bonitacion, too!

SO what happened Margo, somebody took the toys?

I see Monika you to no get the point - you to not understand the problem here...

Of course we all do not need the bonitations. We can breed WTHOUT THEM.
Of course we can make our own fake bonitation - we can meet us all on dog shows, grill parties or any other meetings and make some pseudo-bonitation written on our private bonitation cards.
You are RIGHT - WE CAN DO THIS. Ela can do it in Poland, people can do this in Germany, Holland, France, Italy, Finnland. In any country. And the Czech and Slovakian Club can not forbid people to do this. Czech and Slovakian Club do not have influence on it.

BUT IT IS NOT THE TOPIC HERE!!!

CzW owners from other countries do not want any FAKE bonitations!!!! If the Dutch and French clubs invite you they EXPECT that you will make a bonitation STRICTLY according VALID Czech regulations. They pay you for judgment and for the trip and expect PROFFESIONAL WORK. Not a parody "because they don't need it" but a REAL BONITATION looking exactly the same as the bonitations in Czech Republic.

The same was with Osieczna - the people there were thinking it will be CZECH bonitation made according CZECH rules, on the CZECH cards and that they will get CZECH bonitation codes.
And not FAKE bonitation made by a FAKE club, with FAKE codes written on a FAKE bonitation card.


It is so hard to understand the CzW owners do not want to have FAKE bonitations but they really want to do MORE than just the basic requirements in their countries.
And ESPECIALLY YOU, should help them. And not to try to convince them to make FAKE bonitation instead of bonitations made according valid regulations...


It is exactly the problem with Osieczna and bonitation in Poland. Please stop to tell some fairy-tales about the competition and rivals... That is (another) lie - I do not have any problems with people who want to organize bonitations in Poland. On the contrary - several breeders plan to make more bonitations in Poland this year and I help them as much I can. It is also in my interest to provide my puppy owners the possibility to make bonitation not only in Pozna but several times in a year - in different places in Poland (not only on the German border).
But I would like that they can pass REAL bonitation - not FAKE with FAKE codes but normal one: with real proffesional bonitation comittee, with real codes. On real cards.
All breeders who plan it want to do their job PROFESSIONALLY: they want to fullfil all reqirements. The bonitation in Osieczna was an exeption - and they KNEW they make it against the rules. But for them it was not important - important was to get good codes - in many cases MUCH better that they would get during a REAL bonitation... And you know what: the whole s'fight' was worth doing because the "osieczna team" was forced to gave up the organization of FAKE bonitations (like the one in 2009) and this year they prepare a REAL Czech bonitation which will be listed on Wolfdog when we will get the exact date.
No - nobody in Poland is against competition. We do not fight with people "thinking differently". Till they not start to LIE, to CHEAT and to DECEIVE...

I hope it is clear to you.

[Monika]

I will respond to your graphomania attack, Margo is not necessary and everyone know you. (Me, too of course sweet Ina )

You're a great manipulator and Internet brawler.
The German, Polish, Belgian, Italian, Swiss, French, etc. bonitacion was called " all Czech and Slovak Commission?? Never!!
Except in Pávia 2008
This is your great delusion! And all oragnizators of abroad bonitations knows it.
Breeding Commission has meaning only in terms of controlled breeding in the CR and SR. Breeding committee member can become anyone. Not have to study its function, no school, no need to sit the exam! Accountability does not exist!
The situation in Poland I know
On abroad bonitacion is always invited Judge, only!!

And Your problems are for me ridiculous. Sit and write and write, dear Margo. I bealive, somebody will listen it... this is your life, very sad.
You and wolfdog. org isn ´t any official institution! You are not FCI and you not respect FCI or CMKU etc!...., You can´t to say who is Judge or not, that dog is a stud dog, who is the breeder FCI of CSWs or not. You trying only manipulate dates here! This is all.
For me this chapter closed. Dogs bonitation I reviewed 100x maybe 1 000 x however you try to challenge it, Margo, who has dogs from me and my person made bonitacion of them.

But your truth is always right, of course

Monika

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Well sorry, the German ones normally have, usuallly there is the judge, mostly the Slovakian breeding advisor and the responsible person of the German Club. The rules follow the Slovakian procedure. Slovakian judges don´t make bonitations when the rules aren´t followed.

And still no answer to this very simple question, maybe it was too difficult. Who made the rules? Who were the responsible persons beside you??
I am only interested in that one Polish Bonitation, you must remember, you have been there, it can´t be that difficult.

Ina

[Monika]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

Well sorry, the German ones normally have, usuallly there is the judge, mostly the Slovakian breeding advisor and the responsible person of the German Club. The rules follow the Slovakian procedure. Slovakian judges don´t make bonitations when the rules aren´t followed.

And still no answer to this very simple question, maybe it was too difficult. Who made the rules? Who were the responsible persons beside you??
I am only interested in that one Polish Bonitation, you must remember, you have been there, it can´t be that difficult.

Ina

I am absolutly sure, that everything was said here!
Read well and agian.
....and about which German bonitacion you are speaking.. " MOSTLY " ??
Ina stop these speculation!

Monika

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Who was in the comission and what rules did the bonitation follow??

Come on it can´t be that difficult to answer two questions!

[z Peronówki]

Originally Posted by Monika

The German, Polish, Belgian, Italian, Swiss, French, etc. bonitacion was called " all Czech and Slovak Commission?? Never!!
Except in Pávia 2008
This is your great delusion! And all oragnizators of abroad bonitations knows it.

I told you once, I will repeat it again: PLEASE READ THE REGULATIONS OF YOUR OWN CLUB!!
After you will finally read it please show me the place where it is written that the bonitation comittee MUST be made only by REAL CZECHS - "PUREBREED" (for generation of course) Czech people... And it is not valid in the case when member of the breeding comittee is foreigner....