Cost to Buy and Import

[Wolfsirius]

There is also huge differences between countries with a living costs, or costs to feed/keep your dog.
Often is more cheap and easy to get a pup from europe, if you are living middle of europe, than if you are living "middle of nothing".
If pup cost 1200 eur in Poland, is quite high price comparing the average livingcosts / or salary people there get. Always if i travel in Poland (or few other countries) almost everything is really cheap to me
(i do not speak about dogs now) and if i compare Finland prices for living in here, for prices to live many other countries in europe, i must say, that puppyprices should be higher in expensive countries, than these "cheaper" countries. I don't know, but maybe someone can tell me, how much average man earns from work monthly in Poland??

In Italy there is lot of breeders, and i think they have different prices, i do not believe all pups in Italy goes for 1200 eur, even not all pups from Finland goes for higher prices, we had gave pups also for free.. and i think breeders in many countries had done same sometimes. Everyone have reasons for that.

Fila Brasileiro's cost here now ca. 1500 eur, but years ago, as there wasn't many, it costs ca. 3000 eur.

Black Russian terrier from top breeder RUSSIA, cost 1200 to 1300 eur, and this is quite big money for Russian people, comparing their average earnings.

-Suski

[z Peronówki]

Originally Posted by Wolfsirius

If pup cost 1200 eur in Poland, is quite high price comparing the average livingcosts / or salary people there get. Always if i travel in Poland (or few other countries) almost everything is really cheap to me

Sorry but I will not agree.... The prices should not base on the living costs in specific country because breeding I not about getting the money for daily life but about the money you spent FOR the dogs and FOR breeding... There are people in West Europe which spent (almost) NOTHING. Only few amount of money for feeding the dogs. And there are people in East Europe which spent a LOT of money for training and showing the dogs. So I think is is no wonder the puppies from West Europe will be in some cases cheaper than in East Europe...

The same "fairy tale" is told about the prices. Sure it is cheaper to leave here (but it is also changing last time) but we have to spent in many cases much more money because breeding of the dogs is a LUXURY. For a long time I was buying high quality dog food in Germany - it was about 50% CHEAPER than in Poland. The prices for dog shows are the same in Poland and Germany and higher than in Italy. When I show my dogs in Slovakia or Czech Republic I have to pay MUCH MORE than for example in Germany (50-70 EUR for every dog if you want to compare it). Vaccination are the same as in Germany. Passports are more expensive in PL. Blood test also. Cheaper is only veterinary work but only in small clinics. If I need professional help I have to pay similar price as in West Europe but by a heathy breed as Wolfdogs it do not have huge infleunce....

So if you speak about the prices - it make no sence to base it on the country but on this WHAT the breeder make WITH and FOR the dogs... Because it is what (should) have the biggest influence on the price of the puppies...

[Wolfsirius]

maybe you are right in some things you wrote.
but i do not believe, that example in england breeders use more time and money for their dogs, than other people, comparing the prices. and, for me does not matter what breeders ask from their puppies, you can always ask what you want, and those who pay, they will pay, those who think is too high/or low, go to some other breeder, IF IT IS BECAUSE OF MONEY. Personally i do not look about the price of pup, but other things. There had been also puppies offered for free to me, but i was not interested.

Years ago i could get fila brasileiro very cheap easily out from finland, but i bought my fila from finland, and it was 2 or 3 times higher price than ex. in CZ. But i am very happy with my choice. So price should not be the main thing, as choosing a pup. Even, pup must have reasonable price.

-Suski

[Margo]

Originally Posted by Wolfsirius

you can always ask what you want, and those who pay, they will pay, those who think is too high/or low, go to some other breeder, IF IT IS BECAUSE OF MONEY

No - it is not about money. But I don't think ANYONE want to pay more and getting less than by any other breeders...
As I told - prices base on NOTHING. They are just invention of the breeders. And the posts above are the best example... The average breeder from UK or Finland (basing on the show results, working results and matings) spent less money than average breeder for example from Germany... So I really do not see any reason why the prices are 2x times higher. I will not believe living in Germany (the living standards) are 2x worser in Germany than in UK... or Finland...

So shorty:

YES. Every breeder can ask their own price. He/she do not need ANY reason to ask even 5000 EUR for a puppy.

NO. The prices have (should have) nothing to do with country and there is no explanation that "western" puppies MUST be more expensive that "western" puppies.. There are breeders in "cheaper" countries spending a lot of money for their dogs. And there are breeders in "Western" countries which spent nothing.

YES. The puppy buyers decide what they want and which breeders they will choose... It is their choise if they want to buy "no-name" and sometimes even no-pedigree puppy for 2000 EUR or they will buy "champion-offspring" for 700, 800, or 1000 EUR...

[Hanka]

Hello Butterfly,
if I can advice you, don´t look at price.
look at this:
-have both parents of puppy X-ray result?
-have both parents bonitation? What bonitation code?
-can you see video from thear test of character from bonitation?
-show titles......Not important. You can have much titles in country, where is not much wolfdogs on shows. Much ugly wolfdogs are champions of some countries.
-if you know more about wolfdogs, for you can be "interest"- what blood has puppy? is it good for you?= for breeding in your country?
-have parents of your puppy any defect what is disqualificated for breeding? (all is wroted in strandart, but much wolfdogs with it is breeded,...)

[Margo]

Originally Posted by Hanka

-have both parents bonitation? What bonitation code?

I will be the "bad woman" again... Since the bonitation is also made by people who have no even basic knowledge how to judge and measure the dog I will add also by this point "Not important." Sure you can take into consideration the bonitation made by O.Dora or S. Bognarova but by the rest be VERY carefull... Sometimes a dog which have boniotation code "perfect" and P1 is so in the reality so UNTYPICAL that should be judged as P14...And we have MANY example for it...

The same is with the video from the bonitation character test. It is also for nothing since some dogs train with people who later make the bonitation...

No - I will say that the dog shows results and bonitation codes are important but ONLY if they are made (judged) by a real experts.

Butterfly, there is only one thing which counts - the COOL BRAIN and COMMON SENSE - the knowledge how to distinguish the facts from the public relation "bla bla" told by the breeders.... If you really want to choose a good dog from a good breeder - visit some breeders and see their dogs in reality. Do not base on the advertisment written in internet and on the forum... Because in the virtual reality all breeders are perfect, all dogs are nice and have good characters. All breeders are responsible and carring for the dogs...

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Hanka

Hello Butterfly,
if I can advice you, don´t look at price.
look at this:
-have both parents of puppy X-ray result?
-have both parents bonitation? What bonitation code?
-can you see video from thear test of character from bonitation?
-show titles......Not important. You can have much titles in country, where is not much wolfdogs on shows. Much ugly wolfdogs are champions of some countries.
-if you know more about wolfdogs, for you can be "interest"- what blood has puppy? is it good for you?= for breeding in your country?
-have parents of your puppy any defect what is disqualificated for breeding? (all is wroted in strandart, but much wolfdogs with it is breeded,...)

Yes I think you are 100% right way look at show results at all on a working breed look at work and bonitation (standard) Test instead

Regards / Mikael

[martiou07]

I found certain asking price in France well too excessive (of 1500 to 1800 euros….), I see that is not better in other countries ..... In France, the price which I would describe as normal locates between 800 and 1200 euros for a pup dog wolf (male or female). at this price there, obviously one can find all and import what, but by paying attention at which is taken the pup, there are the H-D result of the parents and even in certain cases the bonitations.

so long

Martial

[Margo]

Originally Posted by Mikael

and bonitation (standard) Test instead

Look ONLY on the standard... In the last month I visited two bonitation. There were two cases of dogs with wrong indexes Xv=50.
Czech dog with such index was judged by a Czech judge and get PERFECT bonitation code P1 (note "Excellent"). The second dog was judged by Slovakian judge and get P5 (note "good"). According the "standard" dog with such index can NEVER get excellent note.

But it is common case - in Czech Republic bad or very bad indexes have no influence on the bonitation code so in such case the Czech bonitation codes are much better than the Slovakian and MUCH better as they can be. The same is with open lips and atypical heads. It has no influence on the bonitation codes and you can see dogs with EXTREMELY heavy heads with no typical expression for this breed which are "rewarded" with the highest possible note...
(of course not all Czech bonitation codes are wrong and not all Czech dogs are atypical but there is visible difference in the bonitation codes). So the only solution is only to ask other (friends or) breeders for help or visit the bonitation and see which dog is REALLY perfect...

[Nebulosa]

Originally Posted by Hanka

-show titles......Not important. You can have much titles in country, where is not much wolfdogs on shows. Much ugly wolfdogs are champions of some countries.

Much ugly dogs are champion of some countries, including the country of origin of the breed.
Sorry but I will disagree completly with you, we have ever few dogs on dogshows here but our dogshows are far away better in selection than yours, some dogs I saw winning the dogshows that I had vizit on europe would NEVER get more than one "good" on ours dogshows if they not get disqualified, the difference is simply, mostly Brazilian judges at least knows how to judge properlly movement, thing that I never saw happening in europe.

[Navarre]

Originally Posted by Wolfsirius

In Italy there is lot of breeders, and i think they have different prices, i do not believe all pups in Italy goes for 1200 eur,

Hello, in our country the price range is about 800-1500, but of couse you can find puppies at 400 and puppies at 2500, but are rare cases.

Often puppies sold at 2500 aren't better than puppies sold at 800, often are same lines, often are even worser, sometimes are a mix and not purebreed !
Maybe that the breeder selling at 2500, after short time will sell the remaining puppies of the same litter at 1000 or even lower.
I agree with Margo, the prices many times is based on nothing.

For example we aren't "breeders", we don't need to earn money from our dogs, isn't our work, but they are good dogs of good lines, with xray, bonitation, exhibitions in our country and in countries of origin, schutzhund training, endurance train. and even playing as actors in movies and commercials...potentially we can sell them at a very higher price, but we sell them at 1200.
3 years ago we sold them at 1000, the litter was very OK, so now 1200.
We prefer to have many potential owners to choose from.

But you cane easily find other litters sold at higher price...but the breeder with his dogs did...absolutely NOTHING (apart from feeding them) , neither pay the mate, as the male is of his own.

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Margo, for what I konw the cost of life in Sweden/Norway/Finland is very high, higher than rest of EU, but of course even their personal income are higher.

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Everything comes to the same conclusion (as all the times before) a puppy-buyer that invests time to get to know the breed, to visit breeders, clubshows and bonitations on different occasions will know enough to get a good dog for a sensible price. The puppy-buyer that doesn´t take this time will take the risk to get a not so good dog for a astronomic price. How do you know the breeder has got good dogs and is a good breeder if they are the only ones you have ever seen?

Ina

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Navarre

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for what I know the cost of life in Sweden/Norway/Finland is very high, higher than rest of EU, but of course even their personal income are higher.

The price fore incurence on a CsV is about 20-30 Euro / month...
and 14 kg of good dog food is about 50-65 Euro...
Bones and pig ears about 10-20 Euro / month

.....................
To all...

But all rear or popular dogs are expensive here, even the ones that almost do not eat at all like the Chiwawa, and it cost about 1800-2000 Euro.

I think The prices in Finland are OK, if the dogs have X-ray and Bonitation, as it will cost alot of time and money to go get your dogs Bonitated in for example Germany, Check or Slovak...

CsV breeders in Scandinavia have to charge Scandinavian prices, they can not sell a rear dog for the same money as a GSD or a Poodle as it will cost mush more to import, own and breed CsV...

Very best regards / Mikael

[*Satu]

Puppy from CZ, 800e, Parents and whole bedigree HD clear,Bonitation codes and show results.
(puppy have HD D/D)

Puppy from SK 300e-1500e, 3 different breeder.
Puppy from CZ 200e-1500e many different breeders.
Puppy from Finland 0e-2500e 3 different breeders
Puppy from Poland 400e-1200e 2 different breeders
Puppy from Italy 1500e-2500e 3 different breeders
Puppy from Germany 1000-1700e 2 different breeders



and traveling 6000km whit car cost nothing... 15l bensin/100km it´s only holiday only


And how many breeders pay taxes??? Maitting and puppy selling is only 40-45% taxes in here. (if you have litter every year breeding is your job is not hobby anymore)

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about other breeds...here GSD can cost 800-2000e. Dog whit out pedigree (mix) can cost 200-800e.

wolfcrossing dog = 2000e->

Also information

Other breeders can´t make litters every year in one female. (females are not puppy mashines)
Other can make only 4 litters in one female....

Others can make puppies every year whit same female.
Some one can make even dog is very young or old.