Differences in breeding strategies and regulations

[Neufi-friend]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

Happy Birthday from mama Falin and the nearly 3 weeks old new 9! brothers and 1 sister!

I was looking through the beautiful photos and I astonished I read Your post. I have absolutely nothing against using internet for promoting the litters. I only wondered because Barushka seems to be very young female and I was not wrong. In the database I found out she was born in January 2008 and there were also 10 puppies in the litter. According to Your words the next huge litter was born in December 2008.

On the German forum I read only good opinions about Your kennel; with the exception of Christian who is writing always very negative.
I was disappointed during reading the topic about breeding using dogs without breeding rights where You confirmed that You are intentionally using males which do not fulfil the German regulations. I decided that everybody makes mistakes. But it seems breaking the regulations and making mistakes is just Your way of breeding.

Could you be so kind and explain me how it is possible that so called number one breeder in Germany is not able to keep to the basing VDH-rules which clearly say only ONE litter per year is allowed?

And as far I can follow You founded the German TWH Club and You are also member of the club board and on the same time author of the paragraph saying:

"Pro Kalenderjahr ist je Hündin nur 1 Wurf zulässig. Nach erfolgreicher Belegung muss mindestens ein Zeitraum von 10 Monaten bis zur nächsten Belegung eingehalten werden. Gerechnet wird von Decktag zu Decktag.
Hündinnen, die aus dem letzten Wurf mehr als 8 Welpen aufgezogen haben,
einschließlich Ammenaufzucht, dürfen frühestens nach 365 Tagen ab dem Wurfdatum wieder belegt werden."

For non German speakers:

"One female can have only one litter per year. There should be the interval of 10 monts difference between two matings. Counted between two coverings.
Females which gave birth to more than 8 puppies can be covered first after 365 days (counted from the last date of birth)."

How it is possible that a breeder who claims to be the best breeder in Germany do not follow any rules? Neither of the German kennel club nor of the TWH Club which they founded? What are the reasons? At the moment I can't think up any besides the financial reasons. For sure it has nothing to do with love to dogs and this breed. And sadly I must agree the only true opinion about You was the one written by Christian. Till today I though Your goal is to keep in Germany high level of breeding and asking the German breeders to do more then other do. But now I see it was only showing that other are not as good as You are and blaming other breeders that they do not do enough or that what they do is wrong as in the case of Christian's litter. And although you are writing pathetic words at them same time You to not keep to Your own demands - You do not keep even to the basic regulations given by the VDH in order to protect the animals against greed of the breeders.

[massimo]

Neufi Friend
sorry but I consider it a lack of respect to me and to all other Forum members if you do not introduce yourself and most of all if you come up with an argument which has NOTHING to do with my Thread.

Please moderators could you move this new message into another thread?

Massimo

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Dear so called Neufi-Friend,

as Massimo already wrote, this has nothing to do with the original thread.
So would you be so kind, do your homework and introduce yourself in a new thread.
If you haven't got the the guts to do that I consider you and your opinion as irrelevant to me.

Michael

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Originally Posted by Neufi-friend

I was looking through the beautiful photos and I astonished I read Your post. I have absolutely nothing against using internet for promoting the litters. I only wondered because Barushka seems to be very young female and I was not wrong. In the database I found out she was born in January 2008 and there were also 10 puppies in the litter. According to Your words the next huge litter was born in December 2008.

On the German forum I read only good opinions about Your kennel; with the exception of Christian who is writing always very negative.
I was disappointed during reading the topic about breeding using dogs without breeding rights where You confirmed that You are intentionally using males which do not fulfil the German regulations. I decided that everybody makes mistakes. But it seems breaking the regulations and making mistakes is just Your way of breeding.

Could you be so kind and explain me how it is possible that so called number one breeder in Germany is not able to keep to the basing VDH-rules which clearly say only ONE litter per year is allowed?

And as far I can follow You founded the German TWH Club and You are also member of the club board and on the same time author of the paragraph saying:

"Pro Kalenderjahr ist je Hündin nur 1 Wurf zulässig. Nach erfolgreicher Belegung muss mindestens ein Zeitraum von 10 Monaten bis zur nächsten Belegung eingehalten werden. Gerechnet wird von Decktag zu Decktag.
Hündinnen, die aus dem letzten Wurf mehr als 8 Welpen aufgezogen haben,
einschließlich Ammenaufzucht, dürfen frühestens nach 365 Tagen ab dem Wurfdatum wieder belegt werden."

For non German speakers:

"One female can have only one litter per year. There should be the interval of 10 monts difference between two matings. Counted between two coverings.
Females which gave birth to more than 8 puppies can be covered first after 365 days (counted from the last date of birth)."

How it is possible that a breeder who claims to be the best breeder in Germany do not follow any rules? Neither of the German kennel club nor of the TWH Club which they founded? What are the reasons? At the moment I can't think up any besides the financial reasons. For sure it has nothing to do with love to dogs and this breed. And sadly I must agree the only true opinion about You was the one written by Christian. Till today I though Your goal is to keep in Germany high level of breeding and asking the German breeders to do more then other do. But now I see it was only showing that other are not as good as You are and blaming other breeders that they do not do enough or that what they do is wrong as in the case of Christian's litter. And although you are writing pathetic words at them same time You to not keep to Your own demands - You do not keep even to the basic regulations given by the VDH in order to protect the animals against greed of the breeders.

Following Massimos wishes I opened up this thread.
1. I will answer you this one time though your write anonymus.

Everything is in confirmed with the VDH as you know from the German forum. Everybody else who needs to know in English is very welcome to contact us via PM.

Ina

[Neufi-friend]

Originally Posted by michaelundinaeichhorn

4. Every kennel club of every country has the possibility to give special permissions in the interest of the breed, does so and will do so in future.

I received very interesting private message and I will not ask about the permission given by the TWH club since I get know the majority of the board is made by Your puppy owners and from them Your will get permission even for 3 litters a year. I'm asking about the permission given by the VDH since I'm sure they will be not happy to know that a breeder produced 20 puppies from one female in ONE and the same year.

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Still no balls?
Usually I tell people with no name to bugger off, but since Newfoundland Dogs and obviously their friends are not the fastest moving animals, I kindly ask you now to introduce yourself.
Otherwise you're not worthy wasting an answer on.

Michael

[massimo]

Originally Posted by Neufi-friend

since I get know the majority of the board is made by Your puppy owners and from them Your will get permission even for 3 litters a year.

I suppose you mean to say that Zlata Palz puppy owners can be conditioned and bribed some way by Micheal Eichorn?
This is a very superficial remark...
I own a Passo del Lupo, a Crying Wolf and a Zlata Palz.
Believe me, they are all my friends but the breed for me is a bigger friend than all 3 put together.
But as I don't even know who you are, you may even be a 10 year old immature child so I really don't know why we should waste our time on you.
massimo

[Nebulosa]

Neufi-friend, its your 3º post talking about or trying to attack Zlata Palz kennel, that means, all your posts.
Then as you're almost an anonimous here you will have 3 days to fullfill your user datas on control panel or I will have reason to think you're nothing than a troll.

[Mikael]

I agree it looks like a personal attack on Zlata Palz kennel, But…

I also think this is reasonable roles to follow by ALL breeders just like in nature…
And I do not think just because a club say it´s OK its OK...

One female can have only one litter per year. There should be the interval of 10 monts difference between two matings. Counted between two coverings.Females which gave birth to more than 8 puppies can be covered first after 365 days (counted from the last date of birth).

But I also think Ina as a vet knows more about this then me,
but I can not realy see the reasen way to mate again the same year...

And I also think that any good person that care about the breed, will signe his posts by his real name...

Best regards / Mikael

[Navarre]

dec. 08 to jan 08 is nearly a year ! I don't see any "scandal".

May be you Neufifriend, don't know how STRANGE could be the heat of our dogs...my female go in heat only when she goes in camper (mobile-home)!!!

And please, stop trolling around.

[hanninadina]

They are praying water and drinking wine.

I cannot belive Mass and Nebulosa, please concentrat on the main fact! The fact is 20 puppies from one female and we have only about 60 puppies a year in germany!

The main thing what a so called first class breeder is doing. They are blaming Passo del Lupo that they breed only for moneying, not knowing that Pdl is earning money not with dogs. They are blaming experienced breeders as z Molu Es because of Mutara thing and they are using a male for breeding last litter coming out from a french breeder who has an american wolfdog and making puppies with csw. And telling, they saw the b- and C-litter csw in german speciality in 2008 that these dogs could not be clean csw. But using one of them for breeding. They talking with a tongue of a snake. That is the truht and everybody who looks behind the scene, no wrong now no one have to look behind the scene, because Neufifriend makes theme out of it.

I cannot understand why the answer to his question is so difficult, that they say please write pn. That is the same way they did in german forum. We don´t know til today what is the reason that makes the litter so important for german breed. Is it new wolfblood from second generation or what?

Mass and Nebulosa why are going on wrong warfield, why do you not concentrate on this question breaking the rules not only one time but several times! That is the question and nothing else.

Christian

[Mikael]

I cannot understand why the answer to his question is so difficult, that they say please write pn. That is the same way they did in german forum. We don´t know til today what is the reason that makes the litter so important for german breed. Is it new wolfblood from second generation or what? Christian

Do not the German club knows the reasan ?
Or are they not alowed to say...

Or is the reasan that it was OK becose it was close to a year ???
Sounds like the best reasan to me...

Regards / Mikael

[Nebulosa]

Christian, the main difference is that when wheatever verified user "blame" someone you know who is doing that, here we have one anonimous doing it, so its pretty easy try to attack or blame without show the face.
I will not allow it tough its covardy, if he want to put his oppinion, make more personal questions or even "blame" michael and Ina he must at least identify herself. if he don't have courage to assume qhat he wrote, so I will kick him off then its a tipical troll.

I don't consider make questions blame someone, so if I find that Z Molu Es is involved with Mutara I'm freelly to quest, as i'm freely to accept or not the reply I receive.
But I will not enter in this question here when our problem is with theanonimate.

[Navarre]

Originally Posted by hanninadina

not knowing that Pdl is earning money not with dogs.

Oh, good news! They give puppies for free ?

[massimo]

Originally Posted by hanninadina

... and they are using a male for breeding last litter coming out from a french breeder who has an american wolfdog and making puppies with csw. And telling, they saw the b- and C-litter csw in german speciality in 2008 that these dogs could not be clean csw. But using one of them for breeding. They talking with a tongue of a snake. That is the truht and everybody who looks behind the scene, no wrong now no one have to look behind the scene, because Neufifriend makes theme out of it.

Christian,
being a lawyer you should know better than me that you should be able to prove what you say an write, otherwise stay in silence. "B-C litter ...American wolfdog" is all very confusing and impossible to understand and out of our thread.

If mating a female within a year difference is forbidden in Germany but not in Italy, France, Czech, Slovakia, Hungary, Poland, then it is a German problem, NOT OURS.
You should know well that "skipping" a heat for a CSW means to wait a whole year because of 1 heat per year, and specially when heat is difficult it is a pity to miss.
Also, if puppies were born 11 and then 9 it is not the breeder's fault.
Maybe you suggest to kill 2 or 3 pups so he can be "regular?".
And, moreover, mateing within 1 year (1 year minus a few days) is common with many breeders, take a look at Fendy, Upstream or Jolly for example.

Sorry guys this thread is rather boring and without much meaning to me, so I am, from now on, out.
massimo

[furyos]

christian . .. y NEVER speak about yu and yur kennel .. then really y prefer yu stop yur allusion .. because nobody is stupid : ... everybody know that mikael choose blue de la louve blanche for his last mariage ..and every body know that yur allusion is FOR ME .... what problem yu have with me ???? jalousy .. y don't think so because y never meet yu BUT if y look on yur web site YU; yu have an USA hybrid wolf .. don't forget that ...y m very proud about the mickael 's choice .. and see them last monday .. so exceptional puppies and very wolfish (ears small and up soon)so social ;in best conditions we can imagine for this breed .. in family home with all wishes they want ... we NEVER see yet yur WORK ..... y m just curios to see that .. please yur bad words on kennels (/hungrian italian/french or german ) can go away .. it will better for everybody ....last rumors on yu are not so nice too.. but y don't care about rumors ... ... regards ..frank

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Mikael

But I also think Ina as a vet knows more about this then me,
but I can not realy see the reasen way to mate again the same year...

Best regards / Mikael

Ok now I can se the reasan Thanks fore the PM Ina.

And good luck / Mikael

[Hanka]

Hello Massimo,
in Czech is this regulation ( czech-moravian kynologic. union):

"the female can have maximal 3 litters in two years, ideal is 1 litter/ 1 year. If female has only 1 puppy, it is reguler litter".

[Neufi-friend]

Originally Posted by Mikael

I agree it looks like a personal attack on Zlata Palz kennel, But…

Because You all took it as pure attacks I felt a little bit sorry. It was not my intention to attack anybody but only the way of breeding. I went through the database checking the data on order to not make any mistakes. Now I do not feel sorry any more and I can repeat again the negative words I wrote before.

Basing on the statement given by Michael: "We used Baron Spod Dumbiera before he got the adult Bonitation and we used Enor Maly Bysterez and Gryz Spod Dumbiera without" I discovered that kennel Zlatá Palz bred 10 litters and 4 of them are not bred according the VDH regulations (it means almost 50%): the litters do not keep to the standards which our kennel club is asking because You can not breed with dogs which are not FCI registered stud dogs. I can't find the litter of the dog Gryz in the database and there is the possibility that the number of litters registered not according the given rules but only thanks to a special permission can grow.
We are very proud of the rules set by VDH because it prevents abusing the dogs and sets high requirements for the breeders. But so far I dealt with cases where breeders made even more than VDH is asking from them (additional heath test, examinations). But I never saw a case where a breeder makes less than the basic requirements and a breeder who do not fulfil the regulations do many times. On the German forum all breeders including Michael attack any person who breeds TWH outside VDH but how can You do this while You also are not able to fulfil basic requirements which VDH is asking to have a litter officially registered by them?

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Still no balls, poor you. Cowards are not worth any answers.

Who needs any information on that or any translations of the German Forum is again welcome to contact us.

Ina