Communism - what you think about it?

[Vaiva]

Originally Posted by Morian

i didn't tell it personally for you, but for the people who curse "occupants" etc. i see same effects from eu and many people damn it too, and what?

Morian, how many members of your family were killed, taken to Siberia or had to run away from soviets?

What was this topic about anyway?

[Morian]

vaiva, another question - have you lived in those times you hate so much? i don't want to continue this discussion here, just afraid to offend someone

[Vaiva]

Originally Posted by Morian

vaiva, another question - have you lived in those times you hate so much? i don't want to continue this discussion here, just afraid to offend someone

Not much. I was born in 1983. My parents did. Grandparents did. Or do you think they all just lie about "these times"? They just created some horror stories themselves? Yes, this discussion would be more suitable in private, because it is not about wolfdogs.

Morion, don't you feel that political environment and your nice childhood memories do not allow you to see some things in real light? Please, inform me next time you come to Lithuania, I will be glad to show you the other side

[Morian]

vaiva, i'm very sorry, but for me it's not too difficult to explain your position. but i really don't want to offend you. and believe me, i know about soviets not from "nice childhood memories" unlike you. i don't want to discuss it nor here, heither in private or in lithuania i wrote here what i think and maybe you must read it once again. i wrote that i don't protect soviets, i don't support soviets and surely i don't advertise soviets from my point of view this world is not black/white, hope you also have no problems with your eyes

[Morian]

oh, vaiva, i have an idea if you want to talk about soviets when my communist boyfiend comes home - i'll give him this link

[wolfin]

Originally Posted by Vaiva

Not much. I was born in 1983. My parents did. Grandparents did. Or do you think they all just lie about "these times"? They just created some horror stories themselves? Yes, this discussion would be more suitable in private, because it is not about wolfdogs.

Morion, don't you feel that political environment and your nice childhood memories do not allow you to see some things in real light? Please, inform me next time you come to Lithuania, I will be glad to show you the other side

hmm my parents born in CCCP, grown and end universitat free, can travel in others land who be in CCCP very cheap, when maried became a flat free, have a work without problem. My grandma say - not russian or german was bad, not simple people but politic system .
but yes this not place speak about this. All imperium have and good and bad side. better see in future not back

[Rona]

Originally Posted by wolfin

My grandma say - not russian or german was bad, not simple people but politic system .

Your grandma was right In all times, in all systems, there have always been authorities (decision makers), institutions that supported or struggleed with them and common people who followed various philosophies, values & norms, views, etc. etc. These three notions should not be confused when discussing sensitive issuses

Vaiva, I understood Morian was just trying to point out how stereotypical Draggar's commnent was.

BTW, could the moderator cut the "historic" part out from the main topic?

[Morian]

yes, rona, you're 100% right

[Vaiva]

Originally Posted by Rona

Your grandma was right In all times, in all systems, there have always been authorities (decision makers), institutions that supported or struggleed with them and common people who followed various philosophies, values & norms, views, etc. etc. These three notions should not be confused when discussing sensitive issuses

Vaiva, I understood Morian was just trying to point out how stereotypical Draggar's commnent was.

BTW, could the moderator cut the "historic" part out from the main topic?

I did not acuse any countries or people - just the system Many friends of mine are russians, but non of them are comunists And - Rona - in communist times Poland and Czechoslovakia seemed a nice dream when looking from Lithuania.
Yes, it was nice - studies for free (just be a member of young comunists, have exams from atheism and so on), flats for free (just be a good behaving member of a comunist party, do not think too much also), but to buy a refrigerator you have to stand in line Same three kinds of sausage in a shop (including this ugly "no-meet" boiled thing "šlapenka"), standing in line for an hour for toilet paper (when there is some, not allways!!!), oranges only on Christmas. Same clothes for everyone (still remember sometimes with my friends - "did you have a black synthetic fur coat with round wooden buttons? Mine were green"). Jeans only if you have an uncle in USA who sent it (I still have one in Florida ). And also there was no crime or disabled people, yes, just because newspapers could not write about bad things, only about great tractor drivers and happy factory workers, and nobody cared about disabled people

It is so good to live in a comunist country - not much working, not much thinking and everything is given for free Slaves are allways happy if they do not need to work too much and get some cheap food and vodka, aren't they?

[wolfin]

Originally Posted by Vaiva

It is so good to live in a comunist country - not much working, not much thinking and everything is given for free Slaves are allways happy if they do not need to work too much and get some cheap food and vodka, aren't they?

you to young member this all and speak like this type people who not know who was realy but only heard about this.
slaves are not this people who stay in Lithuania and not runn - not all but bigest procent and was free in mind and in heart, slaves for good lives are this who runn away and cry - "they are a patriots" ...
funny this all and not moore.

[Rona]

One little British girl a few years older than you, Vaiva came to Poland in 1986. When I asked if she liked the country she replied: "I never thought the sun would be shining in a communist country, I thought everything would have to be grey and rainy."

I don't miss the old times at all and I know what I'm talking about. Both my husband and I have our share in fighting the system, and it wasn't funny at all. But people's feelings are universal and in all times they strive for happiness. We were sociable, sensitive, happy and adventurous although we were living under the regime and many times risked our careers and freedom just to behave decently.

It's true, there were some useless ideological subjects at the university but in Poland they either were treated lightly, or taught by wise lectureres who under stupid labels smuggled interesting content. I was lucky to have brilliant courses in the history of economics and philosophy under the "Political economics of socialism" and similar subjects.

Originally Posted by Vaiva

It is so good to live in a comunist country - not much working, not much thinking and everything is given for free Slaves are allways happy if they do not need to work too much and get some cheap food and vodka, aren't they?

Being a slave is mental, not physical or temporal. There are happy slaves in every system and free people in jails. If you look at the masses of people entering every morning huge multinational corporations in their identical suits and realize they'll stay there until dark, don't you see slaves in them? I do.
Under communist rules there were many creative people who worked hard and despite the silly inefficient system did great jobs in various professions, but there were also many lazy and demotivated greedy guys. Just like now!

Just to make it clear: I wasn't a member of a communist party, nor did I get a free flat. My family also suffered from the communist system, but it's not a reason to feel bitter all the time and poison the next generations with this bitterness. History is history - cannot be changed. I find much more disturbing that politicians do not profit from the knowledge of the past and keep repeating the same mistakes again and again

[yukidomari]

Originally Posted by Vaiva

What was this topic about anyway?

This topic is about all the countries which are dishonest. Limited only to 'poor' ones.