'Just for fun' bonitation in Osieczna (PL)

[Rona]

Could somebody help me understand how the bonitation cards circulation operate?

Are the empty cards (and later, the bonitation documents) strictly registered and numbered by the national CSV clubs? Or, if the bonitation is organized in another country, can they be issued by the local national CSV clubs in their language and registered there?
What if there is no country CSV club? Where do the original bonitation cards of the bonitated dogs go in that case?

Is it enough, if the bonitation cards are signed only by the judge or do they need to be signed by the whole commission? Is it possible to issue copies in other languages or only in the original language?

I'm just curious because we are having a lively discussion on the Polish forum re the bonitatin formalities and opinion of people who organize bonitations in various countries would be appreciated.

[*Satu]

I was wondering... What differense was Osiescna and Pozna bonitations? Only comitee? and Organization? Official club?

[Rona]

Envoyé par *Satu

I was wondering... What differense was Osiescna and Poznan bonitations? Only comitee? and Organization?

You mean Późna, where the yearly CSV meetings are organized by the Peron family?

Poznań [pron. 'poznan] is a big city in central Poland, Późna [pron. 'pu:zna]- a little village on the Polish/German border famous for hosting wolfdog.org

[wilczakrew]

Envoyé par *Satu

I was wondering... What differense was Osiescna and Pozna bonitations? Only comitee? and Organization? Official club?

There is no difference.
Both were made in Poland.
Both have the same meaning.

Rona asked inappropriate questions.

Should she ask what the way of the bonitation documents in a country where is the club.

You can not ask about the same thing in a country where there is no club, because there is nobody to answer.

[*Satu]

Why only Osiecna bonitations is only X? but Pozna is correct?

[Rona]

Envoyé par wilczakrew

Rona asked inappropriate questions.

My questrions are appropriate. I'm not interested in Osieczna or Późna bonitations- I've been to none and do not need/plan to bonitate my dog anywhere in the future.

I just wanted to learn how people, who organize bonitations in Germany, France. etc. deal with the bonitation documents to get a broader view on the topic discussed on the Polish forum.

[wilczakrew]

Envoyé par Rona

My questrions are appropriate. I'm not interested in Osieczna or Późna bonitations- I've been to none and do not need/plan to bonitate my dog anywhere in the future.

I just wanted to learn how people, who organize bonitations in Germany, France. etc. deal with the bonitation documents to get a broader view on the topic discussed on the Polish forum.

In Poland we have no club.
So why ask someone who has it.
" in Germany, France. etc. "
There are breed clubs CSV.
I see no connection with the Polish.

[Rona]

Envoyé par wilczakrew

In Poland we have no club.
So why ask someone who has it.
" in Germany, France. etc. "
There are breed clubs CSV.
I see no connection with the Polish.

I didn't address the question to you and it's not your problem why I want to learn something, is it?

BTW I'd like to thank those who sent me e-mails with explanations. Now I understand more, even the reason why wilczakrew is so anxious.

[Nebulosa]

Are the empty cards (and later, the bonitation documents) strictly registered and numbered by the national CSV clubs? Or, if the bonitation is organized in another country, can they be issued by the local national CSV clubs in their language and registered there?
What if there is no country CSV club? Where do the original bonitation cards of the bonitated dogs go in that case?

If the bonitation card are not numered and registered by national CsV club ( Slovak or Czech) so that means I can do my own bonitation here, using the most close kennel club we have or even opening a breding club, as I only need to contact a breeder/judge of the breed for make it and make a comitee of owners/breeder/judges.
If it happen so, bonitation will be more a joke than it already is.
Best think it need to be oficialized by the Slovak or Czech club, registered there, recognized by then.

[Margo]

Envoyé par wilczakrew

There is no difference.
Both were made in Poland.
Both have the same meaning.

Osieczna jest prawie jak Zywiec... A jak wiesz "prawie robi wielka roznice"....

Envoyé par *Satu

Why only Osiecna bonitations is only X? but Pozna is correct?

Do you wonder? Or maybe you are another person who the organizers forgot to tell that they made this bonitation only "for fun"...?

There was not real bonitation comittee, the bonitation was not made according the Czech rules and also the codes do not have the valid form.... We can not publish results of something like this - because saing theat dogs in Osieczna passed a BONITATION would be cheating....

WilczaKrew told us to remove all results of this bonitation as it was not official and we will never get the bonitation codes. And it has been done. Also the 'X' will dissappear...

[Pavel]

The differences between two polish bonitations is, that one is with official delegated judge from club of country of origin and the second one made a normaly judge, which was invited from organisators.

[Mikael]

Thanks for the answer Margo and Pavel.

I think it is VERY important to tell when it is official Bonoitation or an unofficial Bonitation ! And in English please so that (we) ho travel very very long do not travel all they way for a Bonitation we can not use for breeding and put on Pedigree

Very best regards / Mikael

[*Satu]

Ok. But remember if any FCI judge makes any test or show whit out FCI-memberclub (Most be registered in FCI-member club) invitation all results are X. And Judges can have big problems whit FCI.
Every real FCI judge have same FCI rules where they can work.

[z Peronówki]

Envoyé par Ori

Same - about all the lies that was said about Osieczna bonitation.
Osieczna bonitation has an acceptation of CMKU, and papers are in Czech Club. Who wanted to clear it?

I... Where are the results? Bonitation is official thing so why you hide the results? Maybe because they are false? Maybe because the bonitation has been made without following the official regulations? Why the Czech CzW Club have no idea about it? What CMKU has to do with it? CMKU do not organize bonitations - they even do not care for them - it is internal issue of the CzW Club....

Ela, stop finnaly to tell all people fairy tales. Because even your "pack" is saying openly - the bonitation was unofficial, made only for fun and because of it they asked to remove the results from the Wolfdog.org database. Here you have one more time the words of Grzegorz, your friend who was also in the bonitation committee in Osieczna:

Envoyé par wilczakrew

Tak jak napisałaś kilku właścicieli zrobiło sobie sranda bonitace w Osiecznej. Nikt jej nie uznaje i nie ma problemu. Nikt z tych włascicieli nie robi z tego problemu. Nikt nie zmusza Ciebie abyś uznała te winiki jako oficjalne. Nikt z tych osób nie dodał tych wyników do bazy danych. Każdy ma prawo napisać co chce na stronie swojego psa i Ty na to nie będziesz miała wpływu. Czesi czy Słowacy nie zaczną hurtowo kryć tymi psami i przywozić swoich reproduktorów aby pokryć te suki.
Przeciez i tak te szczeniaki z tych miotów nie będą tego miały wpisane w rodowody.

"As you [Margo] wrote some owners made a bonitation in Osieczna just for fun. Nobody is recognizeing it and it is no problem. It is also not a problem for the onwers. Nobody forse you to recognize the results as official. Nobody added the results to the database. Everybody can write on his own web page whatever he/she want [it is about Ela who is claiming that her female passed the Czech bonitation in Osieczna] and you have no influence on it [simply said if someone want to publish lies on his own web page I have no influence on it and Grzegorz is right - it is only the question of code of ethics of such breeder]. Czech and Slovaks will not start to cover with these dogs and will also not come with their stud dogs to cover these female. Also puppies from their litters will have not bonitation code written in the pedigrees."


Sorry but you are the last (and only person) who claims the bonitation was official and the codes were right. It it time to open your eyes...

[Hanka]

For Ori: maybe is some missunderstanding, czech club has nothing to do with bonitation in Osieczna.......

[Monika]

Envoyé par Hanka

For Ori: maybe is some missunderstanding, czech club has nothing to do with bonitation in Osieczna.......

Nebuď trapná Hano. Bonitace byla česká a zapsána do českých karet.

and in English
Do not be ridiculous, Hano. Bonitacion - evalution has been Czech and recorded to Czech cards.

Monika Soukupová

[z Peronówki]

Envoyé par Monika

Nebuď trapná Hano. Bonitace byla česká a zapsána do českých karet.

and in English
Do not be ridiculous, Hano. Bonitacion - evalution has been Czech and recorded to Czech cards.

Sorry Monika but bonitation in Osieczna is like the bonitation of Mutaras - everybody heard that there was something but officialy it do not exist and there are no prooves that it took place...

PS. I didn't knew the rules for Czech bonitation changed this year. Or maybe it was a SUPER-Czech-bonitation made according different rules as all other Czech bonitations...

[Pavel]

Envoyé par Ori

Same - about all the lies that was said about Osieczna bonitation.
Osieczna bonitation has an acceptation of CMKU, and papers are in Czech Club. Who wanted to clear it?

All bonitations, which are supported from Czech Club have a results on official Club pages (http://www.ceskoslovenskyvlcak.cz). Osieczna is not there.

Envoyé par Monika

Do not be ridiculous, Hano. Bonitacion - evalution has been Czech and recorded to Czech cards.

Funny. If everybody used czech bonitations cards (can copy e.g. from this server), then means, that bonitation is accept from Czech Club ? Its a joke ...

[Monika]

Envoyé par z Peronówki

Sorry Monika but bonitation in Osieczna is like the bonitation of Mutaras - everybody heard that there was something but officialy it do not exist and there are no prooves that it took place...

PS. I didn't knew the rules for Czech bonitation changed this year. Or maybe it was a SUPER-Czech-bonitation made according different rules as all other Czech bonitations...

Do not be ridiculous, Margo, Anita and admin withou name The bonitacion - evaluation has been Czech recorded to Czech cards and cards was sent to Czech club.
Who are you Margo, Anita and admin without name? Fanatic polish girl, nothing more.

[Nebulosa]

Envoyé par Monika

Do not be ridiculous, Margo, Anita and admin withou name The bonitacion - evaluation has been Czech recorded to Czech cards and cards was sent to Czech club.
Who are you Margo, Anita and admin without name? Fanatic polish girl, nothing more.

Sorry but its already broken the common sense rules.
Who are you Monika? A ARROGANT judge that THINK knows everything only because is able to gave notes at dogshows.
Tipical "old breeder which turn judge and stop in the time thinking that knows everything", in truth, nothing more than one delay for the dog breeding.
If FCI judges have actualy their judgements so discredited over the world, its because people like you.

A "judge" that needs to remember who are or how "nothing" is other people in every post for try to convince people that your theories are rights, sorry but it would be funny if not tragic.