DNA tests and Laboratories

[mijke]

A lot of laboratories all over the world are working on several new tests for dog diseases.
Of course labs are commercial, so they are developing tests because there is a market for this.
For all the labs, dog owners and dog clubs are a very interesting group, because they have not real commercial /market goals.
Most of these labs are asking dog owners to send for free EDTA blood to do their investigations.
And when they have developed a test the same dog owners can pay a lot for this test!

Most of the labs (and university's!) are asking 4ml EDTA blood for a genetic test (or for developing a new test).
But to be honest they only need 1 mg to distillate DNA. And the rest of the blood sample they can use for other test of themselves.
So the most attractive deal for a lab is to receive hundreds of blood samples of the same breed of group!! (So I do understand the request of the lab that did ask for blood of 500 CsW's for HD DNA research!)

But groups of owners and breed clubs (who can collect a lot of samples for research purposes), can also negotiate with several labs!
They can offer them a lot of blood samples for free for research for a specific test. And in exchange for this, they can ask for a reduced price (for all owners who did cooperate) when this test is available.

All kind of labs have tests for different diseases. (there is not a lab who have all the tests for a breed) So they can make their own price for a test. Only sometimes there is a competition because they have developed the same test. (for an other breed there was a test for 250 dollar in US and now the same test in Europe is available for 90 euro)

Some general info:

Certification:
It is very important that taking blood samples for tests and DNA storage is conform international control rules! A vet has always to check the chip number. He has to guarantee that the blood sample he send is really of the mentioned dog.

DNA storage:
Every dog owner can storage DNA material of his dog in a lab for research in future. This can by swabs or EDTA blood sample. For storage for longer time EDTA blood is recommended.

DNA - database:
A DNA-database (archive) is a storage where are collected samples of individual dogs. When it is necessary a lab can determinate DNA of 1 mg of the material.

Dog owners , a DNA database, and tests:
Individual dog owners can send a 4 ml EDTA blood for storage in a DNA database. When a owner wants to test is dog, he can send a request to the storage lab to determinate DNA. They only have give their own registration number and ask this Databank lab to send DNA to a specific lab for a test.
The storage lab can determinate the DNA and send it to another lab for a specific test. (The storage lab will ask money for the determination of the DNA, when it is not a test of their own)

DNA research database:
This is also an archive database. But a group (for example a breed club) is owner of such a data base. They manage this database for the health of a population of a specific breed. They can negotiate with labs for developing of tests. But they can also decide to do a test with blood of the whole storage to see how a disease is spread in the population. (and then they can negotiate with labs for quantum discount!) With a DNA research archive it is with new health problems also possible to see where it did start in the past.

Number of test that is possible of a blood sample:
Of 4 ml EDTA blood a lab needs a mg to distillate the DNA. The number of genetic tests they can do from 4 ml EDTA blood is about at least 200.

DNA profile:
It is also possible to make a individual DNA profile (specific identification) of a blood sample of a dog. In the past several dog owners did this, and did receive a certificate.
But because of technical development since 2006 there is a new international ISAG norm for DNA profile. So the identification of all dogs who did have a profile for 2007 is not right (and legal) anymore.
And of course we can expect new specific norms in future!
So maybe it is better for owners only to make a profile when they need this for descendant research or covering (conform the norms on that moment)

Maybe it is an idea to create an international CsW DNA research data base.
On this moment I really don't know who can arrange this the best!
Maybe the best is a cooperation of breed clubs, who can negotiate with several labs about possibilities. (before storage it is very important to make a deal with a lab about rights, prices aso)

And later on this cooperation can (as owner) manage this research database for all kind of research and tests for the health of the whole population.
And when they have a lot of blood samples they are very interesting for all kind of labs!!
So they can also negotiate with several labs for quantum discount and prices for tests.

But maybe this is only my personal thinking for a far future !

But till that time I will still test my dogs for several things and I'll try to convince other owners to do the same!
Because that is the only way to see how diseases are spread in a breed.

[Juniorwolf]

Once again, thanks for info

I hope more people will join your idea about an international CSW DNA research database, to me it sounds very interesting.

Greetings Rolf

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Well, finally I got through to the person working at the HD-DNA research. It is done by the Veterinary University in Hannover. They do DNA-Blood-storages at their institute the price per blood sample is only 7,-- Euros. At the moment they have quite a lot of research done on dogs HD, Epilepsy, Cardiomyopathy, ED, Genetic Eye Diseases and so on.
Going back to the HD, they want for a start 24 Blood samples, 12 HD A, 12 HD C - E of dogs that are as less related as possible. When we manage to get that far they will talk with us about how to carry on. It may be possible to get this amount in Germany but I would like to ask for international help because the dogs should be of a wider genetic range than we have here. We will at least need 100 HD A and 100 HD C - E to do the research and the price could be (that has to be talked about) as high as 300 Euros per dog! There are possibilities to get money out of research funds.
So please if anybody is interesting in joining the research please get in contact with me: [email protected]
If I see the possibility to get at least 200 dogs I will try to get the best price possible. At least we should try to get a Blood-storage there for further research.

Here are further informations: http://www.tierzucht-hannover.de/hd.html
it is on German but I will start to translate it in English this evening and put it into the forum.

Ina

[Mikael]

Thanks Mijke and Ina

Ina, Did they need the x-ray photo as well or just the official result and blood ???

Can they do the HD and ED at the same time ???

Do they have a min month time for the x-ray result, as min 18 month for a female and 24 month for a male to get a true and exact result and DNA test ???

Is there any interest from other owners to do eye DNA tests as well ???
And if one have a DNA eye test, is it valid (official) for life and no need to do new eye tests as PRA and more... before every litter ???

Best regards / Mikael

[michaelundinaeichhorn]

Originally Posted by Mikael

Thanks Mijke and Ina

Ina, Did they need the x-ray photo as well or just the official result and blood ???

They need the official result - if possible the detailed one - or the x-ray, plus the pedigree and the blood.

Originally Posted by Mikael

Can they do the HD and ED at the same time ???

There is a working test for GSD that has to be varified for other breeds, the test exists, it´s the same like with the Dwarf test. They work on a test for ED and Epilepsy, when this exists they could do all on the same time. It is possible that I can arrange ED as well but I think we have not enough dogs for that, if your dog has an ED-result like mine do it is surely good to send it with the HD stuff because they could use it someday and they will store the blood.

Originally Posted by Mikael

Do they have a min month time for the x-ray result, as min 18 month for a female and 24 month for a male to get a true and exact result ???

They didn´t mention that, they wanted an official result.

Originally Posted by Mikael

Is there any interest from other owners to do eye DNA tests as well ???
And if one have a DNA eye test, is it valid for life and no need to do new eye tests as PRA and more... before every litter ???


Best regards / Mikael

The eye test is future and I don´t think we have enough dogs for that there are only very few dogs with Glaukoma I know of.
What the breed organisations use the tests for is on their behalf. You still need an HD-x-ray at the moment but you can use the genetic test for judging possible pairings, find out HD-free dogs that have a high amount of HD-genes and so on

[Mikael]

Originally Posted by Ina

It is possible that I can arrange ED as well but I think we have not enough dogs for that, if your dog has an ED-result like mine do it is surely good to send it with the HD stuff because they could use it someday and they will store the blood

.

OK thanks

I have 0 tests this far as Hronec is under 24 month, but next month he is and I will do the HD and ED...

When do you think they/you will be ready to receive the blood samples and x-rays... I think I will get my official results first after the summer...

Regards / Mikael