wolfdogs in australia (im new)
 

hi guys, sorry if this question has already been answered but i was wondering if there is any breeders in australia or if there is laws which do not allow this breed?

any help will be much appreciated.
regards parasks.

No, at the moment there is not. But Sogna Bognarova lives at Australoa now and plans to start over there. It was a very dark day for the wolfdog world when she left but she may be able to help you, she speaks English perfectly.

Ina

Hello,
what i think, in Australia is some long karantene for pups. And it is "end" of wolfdog puppy. It must be always with people. If it will be closed in karantene box longer time, you can say goodbye good socialisation. Every day between people is for small wolfdog very important. What is no problem for small german sheepdog, is problem for small wolfdog:(

Hi everybody,

first of all thanks to Ina for introducing me in such a nice way...:) I live in Adelaide, SA and would like to meet people in Australia who are interested in CSW. I would like to import this breed here, starting with my own dog first. I have to admit that I am missing the whole wolfdog community - meaning people and wolfdogs very much!!! I've started communication with ANKC already and dare to be quite positive about the importation. Well, it will take time, efforts and costs of course. I am aware of how important the education of people prior importing CSW to Australia is and would really appreciate reasonable co-operation with people interested in this breed. Actually, I was looking for Simon Larman from Melbourne, who posted here few years ago. Apparently his email address is not valid anymore, don't anybody have his contact details? Should anyone here like to get in touch, don't hesitate to email me: [email protected]

Sonja

Hi Sonja, you are living :lol::lol::lol::lol:. And what is about long karantene? Is it true or no?

Yeees, Hanka, I am still alive.....:) As for the importation - it is not only about quarantine, you have to gain also a permit to bring the dog here. Duration of the quarantine depends of the period all required vaccinations and tests were done prior the travel. However, the minimum quarantine for any dog is 30 days (and then up to 6 months) and it is linked to vaccinations and tests being done 150 days prior the travel itself. There are only 3 quarantine stations in Australia - in Perth, Melbourne and Sydney. For all interested, more information here: http://www.daffa.gov.au/aqis/cat-dogs
And of course, you pay at every bloody step of the procedure... But I fully agree, even 30 days quarantine is bad for a wolfdog puppy, moreover, there are some other restrictions, I don't remember them all. I truly hope that at least there will be no troubles with an official CSW recognition here, I am quite optimistic in this.

Thanks for info. So I cross fingres for your idea:lol:, bye Hanka

cwd in AUS
 

hi, i have two czech puppies booked for Austrialia this year, they do have quarenteen but this differs, from uk quarenteen is only for 30 days as uk is rabies free, if you need any help on importation to Aus please let me know, you are aware there are very limited quarenteen kennels in Aus and that you need to pre book long in advance of your animal arriving, if you have any questions please email me at [email protected]

Sorry, I think 30 days is too long for any puppy, and wolfdog especially, that's a month lost in learning that there is a world full of people and cars and other dogs. I wouldn't recommend anybody to do that. If anybody wants to import, I would recommend getting a young (and best also bonitated and X-rayed dog - so you can use it safely for breeding) which is already socialized, or coming to Europe and socialize it themselves, or if both are impossible, wait a couple of years and get an Australia-born pup.

hi, I am exporting two cwd to Australia, the importation regulations vary, Europe is different from uk, it differs as in if the country is classified as rabies free, with vaccinations and blood test the earliest a pup could leave uk is approx 4 mths old, i have explained to the new owners about the cwd and that i am not happy about the 30 days quarenteen, they are checking with ministry vets to see if it is possable to import without this 30 days, if not both new owners have agreed that i keep the dogs with me till they are 7-9 mths old, all my breeding stock is health tested, we do not have bonitation in uk but i use copy of the code on my dogs to best of my ability, i also get help from very senior uk judge, i also worry as it is very long flight, i have spoken to another breeder of Akitas in uk as he exported to Aus, he give me email of importer who got a dog from uk, he has told me that the dog he got from uk arrived safe and well and did not seem to be overly affected by the long flight, but this was Akita not cwd,,,I have warned both people that i am still not 100% on sending dogs to Australia, both said they will understand if i change my mind, hard decision,,,,,pacino

Hello Solowolf, I don´t plane export pups to Australia, it was just question (quaratnene) , because here was this topic some years ago.......but thanks for help :rock_3

Hi Pacino, it's OK, if you prepare the dogs for the long flight and long quarantine, I thought you ment young pups, if already grown, that's better.

Well, what I think abou this you can read in another topic (northern inuit dogs), so I won't go into detail here. But if starting a breeding in a far country where import itself is very expensive, I would really try to at least import dogs which were judged by not only senior, but wolfdog-experienced judges, as suitable for further breeding. Especially, as there is a great wolfdog judge Sonya in Australia now.

Oh yes, I forgot that parasks very likely doesn´t know her. Sonja is a very experienced wolfdog owner and breeder that knows the breed since decades, she is a specialised judge, a boniation judge and knows I think most of the CSW population all over Europe. If you think about importing one I would surely take her advice where to get one and out of which pairings. You would have the best possibilities to start over there you can get and you would be two of you to start with the breed what will make things easier.

Ina

It would be interessing, but unhaply the things not work like that.
I know really some cases of people wich ask help of a very famous, experienced judge for introduce a new breed in his country, and it not work like that, what I saw mostly times was people sending really bad dogs ( dogs wich none would buy on the original cuntry) to these far away people who ask for help, saying that those dogs are the best, good lined and so on.
I saw the introduction and the start of some new breeds here, I can garantee you, those that ask help of the club for get good dogs and advices only brings descarted dogs with the illusion of bring a good one "because club say it is", I saw also some champion with very important title for the breed coming, with the breeder thinking it would be a garantee of a good dog, and when the dogs arrive he was really non-standarded dog.. but titled.
In truth seems people from the origin country loves send dogs wich would be a suposedly "shame for a kennel" outside, maybe, as one way to hidden problems in his breeding.

That's why I said bonitated. If you buy bonitated dogs, you know what you are getting.

I personally don't approve of selling bad pups to countries for starting breeding there, but people are different. On the other hand, even if you sell a pup which has good parents and seems fine, it doesn't have to stay like that. Lots of times there is a champion in a litter and a poor dog in the same one. And with the growing etc. you never have a certainty.

Worning !!!
 

I vent to Australia in 2001 and it took me 28h to get from Stockholm - London - Singapore - Sydney...
BELIEVE ME, IT IS A HARD TRIP even for a human. you MUST realy prepare in advance...
and Singapore and Australia can be very very hott...

Good luck Best regards / Mikael, former AUS Cattledog owner

hi,after reading this i have contacted both people who want pups in Australia, i have told them this journey is very long time, i have explained i would only consider sending adult cwd on such a journey. it would be best to maybe get dogs from as far west as possable then maybe the journey will not be so long as from uk,

it is of coarse very important that if cwd are to go to Australia then the best possable dogs must only be sent, it would be expensive, but as the cost is a lot of money i was selling my two cwd for very very little money £200 each i am more interested in getting the cwd to Australia as it is great that people are interested in the breed out there, i also agreed to pay for all vaccinations and the sky kennels, i get the sky kennels very cheap from quarenteen kennels as many people leave them there when they import dogs to uk, as journey is so long it is not for pup or young dog, adult dog is best then at least all health checks can be made before export insuring the best possable start for the breed,,,,,pacino

why would people want to send bad dogs as the dogs sent would represent the breed, in Europe you health check dogs as in uk, but you also have bonitation code so it is up to you to give best advise to people on where to get good dogs from for export, the new dogs are an example of the breed and it is of utmost importance that they are very good examples of the breed. it would be madness to send bad dogs. i take no notice of champion status, its the dog i look at and whats behind it, the show world is same everywhere dogs that are in very small classes can become champion and then you have not the dog champion but who is on other end of lead rope, my friend is judge champion,,,,,,

Because commonly they don't care for what is going on at other lands, principally far away ones, if the breeding have problems or not its not their problem if the breed in their country is fine, so, at end in truth exportations for some countries are only for send outside dogs wich they don't want, and I don't talk here only of introduct a new breed but about bring new lined dogs also.
I considere it madeness because I see non sense in it, I would never do something like that principally because I know how its difficult to bring dogs from outside, but its a sad truth in mostly cases.
For you have an idea, people here for years try to bring good european lined dobermann to my country, but mostly of the breeders give up because the are enough to pay a lot for a supposedly excelent puppie, and arrives a completly different one, sometimes even with different pedigree, so they use americans dobermanns not because its the nicer, but because is where they found honest breeders wich send what they promited.

Unhaply this isn't a far truth for CzW, I had already listen a lot of hystories wich can be confirmed of the same thing, people solding dogs of the "suposedly best litter of the year" when in truth it's a litter that only by the line itself nobody on the country wants have it, you can find even on our breed hole litters beging sold outside because it, for the breed this litter have no value and will not be selled easy on the origin countrie.

How many cases of good addult bonitated and X rayed dogs that was sold happen on CzW? I think we can count on our fingers, without talk about the value of those dogs, even because none will want to give away a good lined, interessing, bonitated and X rayed stud to a country so far away that they have a high probability to never more seen this dog.

What you wrote seems I can confirme for mostly Slovakians I know, but unhaply its like an exception then mostly part of other countries think pretty different, principally when we talk about send dogs soo far away, so, for those commonly its valid what I wrote for Paul above.

Hm, folks, there is no need to guess or contact any ministry about importation requirement information, every requirement is publicly available on the website I mentioned before. Actually, I can't see importation from UK to Australia any easier than from many other European countries, they are all listed there - considered as not rabies free but keeping rabies under control, thus eligible for 30 days quarantine. And don't be mistaken, 30 days quarantine is obligatory minimum, applicable on ANY dog, pure blood or cross, does not matter and there is NO CHOICE to avoid it unless it is a dog of a special purpose. And yes, it is very difficult travel even for a human, I must agree with that, the flight from Europe may be above 30 hours, including the time spent in transit. Moreover, the kennel is sealed and the animal MUST NOT be released before arrival to final destination. Furthermore, age limits etc. So, I think the new owner must be first well educated about CSW, second skilled and patient enough to help the dog to overcome a stressful importation experience. That is one of the reasons I would like new owners here to keep in touch to be able to help each other with at least advice. One of other reasons is to establish a good breeding group, not easy at all. I don't know what Nebulosa means by "bad" dogs sent from the countries of origin, so I speak just in general - when making your choice for a CSW imported from Europe to Australia (or elsewhere) it is of paramount importance to focus not only on appearance but on the breeding compatibility (if you intend to breed or show your dog) with other individuals imported here. If this co-operation does not happen it may result in quite isolation of new owners in this big country, maybe even in mixing CSW with whatever around, as it happened many times already in other countries. As for the dog choice - Nebulosa, I am sorry you have bad experience, but there is definitely nothing like "the best litter of the year". Mostly breeders and CSW clubs are doing there best to achieve excellent results and yet there is no warranty that your puppy will be a world champion once. On the other hand, even "very good" dogs might be very important for the breeding. I agree also with Saschia, importing the dogs that have passed the bonitation and Xray would be the safest way, and the most expensive at the same time, due to an animal value.
As for the Australian climate, yes, I worried about that too but as I see, breeds like alaskan malamutes, siberian huskies, samoyeds and other are nothing rare here and they are able to cope with it. Well, when there is over 40, everyone is "dead fish".
To summarise it, it is important to know as much about CSW as possible, get as precise information about its importation as possible, to arrange the travel very well and the rest is "just a game" - you can find plenty of information how "easy" that game is, with plenty of stories here, ji, CSW are beasts, but beautiful, interesting, adorable and challenging beasts!!!!:lol:

Hi Sona, you missunderstand me

If you read what I wrote for Saschia will see that I had no bad experiences, contrary, the dogs I have are exactly what I was looking for ans exactly what I wait, as I was really glad with Slovakian people because we can really trust they, but as I said for Paul, unhaply they're an exception and even in the CzW we can see cases of the problem I mention.

You may not worrie, its happen with nordic breeds but with CzW its pretty different, they lost the coat and stay with a nice suricat look untill cold arrives, they react best in hot climates than short haired breeds and even pretty adaptated ones, here my wolfdogs are best adaptated to the hot than the brazilians breeds.

hi Paula, as I don't write to forum often I realised only now that it is you - I recognised you by your dogs of course! I am really glad that you are happy with your CSW and yes, I believe it might be risky for a new owner to leave the choice of the dog on someone else. Well, I suppose majority of people in Australia will find themselves in the same situation, that's why it is better to import dogs that are already judged or bonitated and Xrayed.
And thanks for encouraging words about CSW adaptation to the different climate, I believe they are tough and will be all right even here. And I have to laugh - yes, you described it exactly - suricat look it will be.....till the next cold season:lol:

Paula, I know you're a very modest person.... :)

But I think it should be explained here, that Paula's got significant experience in dealing with other breeds (not solely CSVs) and has been cooperating with several kennels and breeeders in Brazil for a few years now. When writing about the problems connected with importing dogs form other continents she is writing about what she and other breeders and friends encountered in reality, not only about theoretical assumptions or rumours. 8)

Sonja,
are you OK? We can read and watch much of fires in Australia.........
Hanka

Hey guys, I'm new to the forums, and am incredibly interested in the CsV. I live in Australia, I'm only 17 but I would absolutely ADORE one of those beautiful creatures once I had the time and space to own one.

Just a quick note,
Hanka, I don't believe there is much need to worry as the fire's here were mainly in Victoria and New South Wales. I believe Sonja lives in SA??? I don't recall there being any fires in SA, Victoria was the worst hit, which was very scary for me and my family :( But they have all been extinguished now.

I was wondering if there was any update about the importation of the CsV into Australia? I'm a fair few years off having my own place and all that, but I think the more updated I am, the more of a chance I could own one in my elder years :P

Thanks guys :)
Spaz

Great attitude, Spaz ;) Hope when the time comes, there will be some possibilities to get a wolfdog in Australia :)

Hello Spaz

My self I would buy a Australian Cattledog if I was you :rock_3

I had one my self, but he did pass away in december :(
but I got almost 15 good years and memories from him,
and for that I´m very grateful.

But if you and some more people wont to buy one or more CsV in the future for breeding, I would personaly recomend a Bonitate (Standard) tested dog from Check or Slovak as the trip is very hard and hot for a puppy, and the best chans to get a good / healthy dog is to buy a (older) one and not a puppy... I would also recomend to import them two and two or more becouse of the quarantine time, so that they will not be alone there or under the tripp...

Or maby if you do not plan to breed and (only) wont one as a life partner and you do not plan to buy one in about 5-6 years from now, there might be a Australian CsV breeder that you can buy your puppy from :rock_3

Or maby you can import one from the USA, Canada or Brazil as it is closer :ehmmm I think, even if they have hard to get a Bonitaion Test you can always look for work and healt tests...

You can find and talk to breeders in PM here >>> http://www.wolfdog.org/php/modules.p...B&file=kennels

PS, I do not recomend CsV if you plan to live in the city or in a flat DS.

Good luck to you and your plans, best regards / Mikael

You may be surprised, but I do:). Or rather I think it does not make much difference where the dog lives provided you can devote him enough time and energy, take him to walks every day (2-3 hrs) and have a place nearby when you can let him run unleashed. Paradoxically it's easier to socialize a wolfdog in a city environment, where he has access to different noises, people, crowds, cars, traffic, etc. than if you keep him in a country on a big, 'ideal' territory. Very often people who have huge gardens report that their wolfdogs spend relatively short time outdoors because they prefer to stay indoors with their pack.

What's more, the "city owner" often spends a few hours with the dog out of pure necessity: he needs to walk him, train obedience intensly, so that the dog behaved in the streets - thus talks to him much and in result it happens that he's able to build suprisingly strong relationship with the animal...

I'm not saying that wolfdogs living in cities are always better behaved and socialised than in the country, or have a better relationship with their owners, but that it is not a major issue where the dog lives. Simply the quality of the relationship with the pack is more important than the quantity of acres you have.

Exactly! A dog left alone in a big yard is not training himself individually :lol: We also live in a flat (situated in the centre of Vilnius, capital of Lithuania :lol:), so it means I can not just open my door and let the dog outside, I have to spend time together with her and we both like it :)

Yes, I agree...

but there also might be BIG problems if the dog howls when you are at work, or if you work long hour and can not have a kennel yard...

Some dogs are OK whit a flat, but some dont, but you are right it is mostly about the time you can spend whit your dog or not that will be the problem if you live in a flat...

Regards / Mikael

I fully agree to that :lol: Living by the countryside is no proof of better behaved and well socialised dogs. In my opinnion do dogs need their "time of quality" by beeing trained and socialised to others. Wide areas of land might be of advantage in addition to that, but I do think "city people" may be more observant of the dog's basic need as mentioned above.
--
Per Olav

wolfdog in OZ
 

Hello all, I'm new here, and i have been searching everywhere for weeks re finding a breeder of the Czech Wolf Dog in Australia. I have read this post ; just wondering has much progress been made in regard to wolfdogs in Aus???
Can any1 help me with the most productive path to speak to some one in Aus about this?

CzW's in Australia
 

Hello all new here, & yes i am going to ask about the CzWolf dog in Oz and how far along it is? I know there have been other threads but they seem to get rather hijacked by nonsense 'periphery' talk. There are many of us here who have become aware of this delightful 'new' breed, so might i ask if those who are in the know with contacts and events pls keep us informed via this thread? Im in for the long haul, but is there actually any1 that HAS imported them yet? Or any1 that is actually DOING it?
Please keep this thread pure to the question re the CzW in Oz... We are all aware the first of any breed is not easily imported, but if those who did import decided it was to hard.... well we wouldn have any of mans best friend here..

Please dont whine about what i have asked or said ; i just wanna have a CzW and so far this is the only site that has a clue about it happening.A credit to you all, but lets make it easy for those surfin tryin to ascertain the liklyhood of it actually happening, when, how and who...

So please, Discuss.

Sonja Bognarova is going to import and would be the best adress for you to contact, especially as she is one of the best experts on this breed.

Ina

Thx Ina, Is there a way to contact this lady? Does she have a web site, or dare i ask ; phone number? Do you know which state she is in pls?

Sonja Boogerova, the best special judge in that breed, originally from Slovakia moved I think 1 or 2 years ago to australia. But I do not know if she took Issy - Issar - with her. Here is the link to her dog. Make a try through her eMail. Send her greetings from me http://www.wolfdog.org/eng/dbase/o190.html

Christian
www.wolfdogs-siouxtala.de

She knows my Myla Crying Wolf

I have read that she intended to import so I will send her an email soon as I can get my silly computer to co-operate.

I have worked out that the website I saw is from an actual member here LOL - silly me! So I am going to try contact both. I really love this breed (well from afar) and its been 10 yrs since my plans to import fell through.

It would mean so much to me to be able to meet one of these gorgeous dogs!

As we will help her with importing I can tell you that Issar is still in Europe. I will ask her to contact you the next time I talk to her.

Regards
Ina

That would just be wonderful Ina. Thank you. :)

Hi everyone,

Ligerwolve2 I too would love one of these beautiful dogs. I am in the sydney area (not far from you) so if you wouldn't mind, could you pass me on any details you find out? I'm not sure if people would mind being emailed numerous times about the same thing... Right now I am just curious about if or when we will see these guys in Australia (I certainly hope so!)

Cheers :)

Does anyone out there have any updates about CVW's in Aus?

I'm hanging out to meet one.....

Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs-Australia
 

Hi everyone,

It's been a while since there was any talk of Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs in Australia.

I read earlier that Sona Bognarova had moved to Australia and was looking at importing, but I can't see any updates on that. I also noticed Mick Wright's Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs, that are supposed to be mixes, they're still great, but I don't think he's selling any.

I've been considering importing, given I can't find anyone in Australia who appears to have any let alone be breeding. The only problem is, is that as of 2012, dogs have to be atleast 6 months before being imported to Australia. Most breeders don't seem keen on the idea of keeping them for that long.

Anybody have any infomation or updates on what's happening? Or has nothing changed since the last threads made about them in Australia.

-Thanks

I don't know if the situation in Australia has changed any, but I do know that if you develop a good relationship with a breeder, some certainly aren't averse to working with you on importation requirements, including the rabies titer wait and others.

Yeah, I'll see what happens. If there's none in Australia in 3 years, and I haven't been able to import. Then I'll just live in the county of importation for the duration of the testing and vaccinations that have to take place untill I'm able to ship the Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs to Australia.

Australia seems a bit empty when it comes to wolfdogs and dogs that look like wolves..

Saarloos Wolfhound-None known to be in Australia.
CZECHOSLOVAKIAN WOLFDOG-None pure that I know of.
Tamaskan-None that are up for breeding.
Northern Inuit-None.
British Wolfdog-None.

sometimes, that's not a bad thing..

I would hope that in the case of the Czechoslovakian Wolfdog, that owners would be required to have some kind of permit. Many people buy them for their looks, and although they have done research, they don't realise how much of a challenge the dog is untill they buy one.

I recently got a Wildlife Permit, as I intend to own a dingo in the future, it's a free permit. Just I had to build a large enclosure and demonstrate that I know a lot about dingoes in order to recieve it.

I don't think they will put a permit when it comes to owning dogs like the Czechoslovakian Wolfdog in Australia, as they're a domestic dog unlike the dingo. But it really would help, as they're not like a normal dog.

But the first step is actually getting the Czechoslovakian Wolfdog recognised here....

What's a British Wolfdog? I've never heard of them.

An innuit cross amongst other things, its a title to sell wolf alike dogs

Aha, thanks for that, I've just been googling them :shock:

fancy name for a regular mix. :)

Just one that the cross breeders in the UK have come up with :?

Also the compulsary (spelling?) quarantine on entry to Australia is harsh on a young pup/dog that has just travelled possibly half way around the world. They must be sealed into their crate in the country of origin (where they must have lived for a min 6 months) and then are only allowed out to enter into quarantine. I understand the need for precautions against rabies, but surely if a dog has been x weeks after a positive titre, the quarantine could be relaxed a little?

I know, I think the quarantine should be 2 weeks at most. I mean the quarantines here aren't bad, they have a large enclosure to run around in, but no I agree, after a long trip going to a strange place like a quarantine kennel where there are a whole bunch of other dogs there can be quite daunting.

Isn't there a regulation (like the one that puts the rules to go to UK and Ireland) that allows the puppy to have a blood sample taken a month after the vaccinations to get the anticorps titles and then 6 months later it can be brought without any quarantine?

The fisrt dogs would be very difficult to be brought there, I realise indeed, but it still would be better than the compulsory (that's the spelling Shadowlands ;) ) quarantine!

Thanks for the spell check, Enid - things have been a little stressful here and my internal one has packed up :p

Unfortunately, the official Australian Quarantine and Inspection Service states "No additional documentation, vaccinations or testing can be completed to reduce or avoid the Australian quarantine period." The minimum period in quarantine is 30 days, irrespective of whether the titre test was done more than 180 days previously - if it was only 60 days previously, the animal must remain in quarantine for 120 days :(. (The regulations state that 180 days must elapse from the date of the titre test before an animal can be released from quarantine, but then goes on to say that it must be there for at least 30 days)

On top of what is likely to be a very long journey, this is quite harsh for any animal, least of all a young puppy :(

Ugh... I just know that I would need to be in quarantine myself with the dog, I would never leave the dog alone :( :( ...

Yeah...it's times like these that really make me hate Australia.....

Nothing much new has happened as far as I know. There are some wolfdogs but they are not bred to look anything like wolves. They are working dogs and not sold to the general public.

As hard as it is for importing I can only respect the lengths they go to. We are a very lucky country in alot of ways.

I would not want to see a permit on them (other than a permit for dog ownership in general) as I dont think this would help the image of wolfdogs being a special BREED rather than a hybrid. If they think they need a permit you can expect the breed to be at riskk of being banned all together.

Ive owned a wolfdog myself in the past. I hope to again in the future but its a rather expensive process and then at the end of the day the dramas of placing a puppy in the right home if you breed. That can be a total nightmare!

The best solution I have heard for importing has been to actually travel overseas, spend time forming a good bond and allowing the dog/s to mature before attempting importation.

Its a delicate situation and best handled carefully rather than diving in and creating a bad reputation for the breed right off the bat.

Dingoes are different again. They can be wonderful companions in their own way though. What an exciting experience for you.

Yeah, in a few years when I have the time if there isn't anything in Australia, I'll live in the country of export for a year, so I can buy them and then I can train them myself and I'll be able to take the puppies to the vets for all the vaccinations and microchipping myself.

When purchasing a dog from countries that are rabies free, I don't really understand why there needs to be so much time before export, but your right, it's best to be safe.

Yes, I love my dingoes. They're alpine dingoes, so they have the lovely thick coat. Challenging, but very rewarding.

Oh nice! Alpines are lovely.

I found talking to the quaratine people directly really helpful to get a better understanding. I look at the last few years as a chance to really get a good understanding of the dogs, breeders, import ect .

That sounds like a great plan and Im sure the breeder you go to will really appreciate the effort as well as the chance to get to know you :)

When a dog is in quarantine, where he is stationed?
I'll explain...for example if i live in a little city in the center of Australia, where the dog lived for the quarantine?

As far as I am aware, the dog would be quarantined in the kennels at the point of entry (if the flight landed in Melbourne, then Melbourne; if at Sydney, then the quarantine would be Sydney).

If anyone knows the official answer, it would be great to know :p

There are designated quarantine stations, around 4, I think, through Australia. Visitation is allowed. A while ago I helped a friend import a dog to Australia. I'll dig up the station list in a bit.

ETA: Ah, here you go: http://www.daff.gov.au/aqis/cat-dogs/accom it's about $100 to process the animal for intake, and then each day for a dog is $39.

Thank you!

Yeah. The Quarantine staff collect the dog at the airport apon arrival. You're not permitted to visit the dog at the airport either, even if you're on the same flight as your dog, you still have to let them collect your dog.

hi there,

just a quick update...... only the male i have maybe a mix, the female is pure breed.

also puppies are on the way in the next few weeks.

Regards Mick.

Puppies are on the way in the next few weeks? Are you selling them? Because I would love to buy one. My email is [email protected] if you'd like to email me.

Thanks,
Nick

I am sorry but your Raven Spirit is for sure a mix.

Ina

So you are breeding 'mutts' ? (Nothing wrong with mutts as long as people know that's what they are getting :) ):? I trust u are not representing them as csv?... Are they at least 'health tested'?

Sad that mix breeding seems to be the 'method of breeding' in countries where CsV are not so easy to get.

Guess people don't really want a CsV or love the breed - simply they just want a 'wolfy looking mix'.

Hi there,

an update from my side too - I haven't imported my dog yet and for few personal reasons it seems I will not import him in Australia. I am still planning to bring pure CSW here, sooner or later. As for importing, breeding and selling/buying CSW with unclear origin in Australia - it is matter of everyone's choice. So far, I haven't met ANYONE in Australia who would be really serious about importing pure CSW here. Because, if there was someone they would have done it already. I went through all authorities not only about importing but also about having them recognised by ANKC, it is quite complicated and costly, but POSSIBLE. If I knew someone here who really means it I would help and I believe there are breeders in Europe who would help too. But honestly, if there is such immediate interest to buy mix pups just to get something resembling CSW and presented as such, instead of importing one, hate me or not, Australia is not ready.

hi all,

feel like im caught between a rock and a hard place........

my partner (at the time) talked me into import the dogs, he is german and at the time we went to germany and i lived there for 6 months to minimize the quarantine time in australia which only ended up being 1 month at the quarantine station in sydney. (total quarantine time is 180 days with minimum 30 days at the quarantine station)

not long after we had our dogs he up and left Australia, leaving me with them.

regards mick.

This might be the reason why you did import them but that can´t be the reason why you bred them.

Ina

I'm sorry to hear of your situation but, the like Ina, I'm not quite sure what this has to do with cross breeding of your dogs :?

Also, if you were intending to breed, why didn't you import a breeding pair - surely it would have been just as easy to import 2 as 1 purebred dog?

Alas, it sounds like the situation (and mentality of many) in Oz is just like that in the UK :cry:

He did import a pair, and he is breeding from that pair. Please read the thread before posting and looking ignorant.

He did not import a breeding pair, but a breeding female and a probably mix-bred dog resembling a vlcak. Who knows what characteristics might such a mix carry in his genes?! Pink coat and brown nose of a saarlos? Extreme shyness of a wolfdog hybrid? Maybe deep chest and falling top line of a GSD?
Apparently this is not a breeding pair, but an "ersatz" of a breeding pair!

So please read the thread before posting and looking ignorant!

You're right Sona: SOME Australians do not seem to understand that matching dogs has little to do with breeding!:(

I was referring to what Mick himself said, that the male is likely not pure. I would have thought that after going to all that effort and expense to import a pair of dogs, that it would have been worth having a breeding pair of PURE CsVs. I'm afraid it is not I who is looking ignorant here :p

Just go back and read. He thought the dogs were pure when he imported, it was only till he posted on this forum that he had people coming on saying they weren't pure, nor have any of these people posted proof of these dogs not being pure yet.

I created this thread to ask about any updates, not to have people come here go off topic, then start questioning other people. So far very few people have said anything constructive. If you don't have anything constructive to say, leave.

He could easily avoid the problem if he would have informed himself. Even if he wouldn´t have come to know that Raven Spirit are mixes with White Shepherds, he would have get the information - and without much bothering - that they don´t have any official FCI pedigrees. There are several breeders in Germany and two clubs and the VDH you can ask. These puppies are NOT Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs and therefor useless for the breed in Australia.

Apart from this: This is an open forum, the title of this thread is Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs - Australia, not "Wolves´ accepted updates only" there is no off topic here.

As always I have to agree with Sona, Australia is not ready yet.

Ina

Please provide the proof for this, as I looked up Ravens Spirit and found no results. So link me up to where you got this information from.

Secondly, ignore the title. Read my first post, it was asking for UPDATES OF CZECHOSLOVAKIAN WOLFDOGS IN AUSTRALIA, not to have people's negative comments about possible Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs that are in Australia. "Australia is not ready yet" How is Australia not ready? You can't just say that 22 million people that you don't know aren't ready to own a dog of their choice. Some Australians might not be good owners, others will be amazing owners.

Now its not true that we have not tried.

I myself went through all the loops, spoke to all authorities needed and I was stalking a few of the breeders on here :lol: This was ...must have been about 10 years ago now. I had $14 500.00 saved and all I really needed was a breeder and to iron out those last few details. Then my husband became very ill. Its unfortunate but everything I had went into taking care of him.

Now Im a single mum of two so although I could care for a dog, be involved with the breed ect I can not afford to import just now. If no one does by the time my kids are older I will try again.

This is not a bad thing. It does not in any way show my lack of love of the breed. I believe if anything it shows that I am very dedicated. Im not rushing in. Im not buying for the looks. Im not some young inexperienced fool hardy backyard person. I care very deeply for this breed.

Just because one person MAY have done something do not paint me with the same stroke. Nor the fact I care enough not to rush into something I cant follow through with - like importing.

Id LOVE a pup. I truely would but hey if I have to wait till I am able to import myself I will.

I have been a member here a very long time (I was originally just Ligerwolve). Quietly reading, learning. I have also been involved in just about every aspect of the dog world in that time. I have even owned a different breed of wolfdog and so has my father.

A few years ago I would have probably agreed with you but I think the minds and hearts of people are changing here. Perhaps because of the people you disregard have been championing this breed and educating others.

Since my last post Ive been thinking. On the flip side.

Id also like to mention to anyone who is thinking $$$ by importing/buying this breed here, be careful.

Not only are there laws from state to state on what needs to be done with puppies, the law is now moving in the direction of breeders being liable. If you do the wrong thing and its proven you will be up for costs.

People need to stop and take breeding very seriously these days.

Breeding is not just throwing two dogs together!

Nor is owning a puppy. Although as breeders we do our best to send puppies home with the right people the buyer needs to stop and seriously think if this is the breed for them.

Someone once said to me you should ask yourself what you can do for the breed/puppy not what they can do for you ;-)

I can assure you that CzW breed does not have a nice experience with this history.
We have breeders breeding mixes and hidding the root of the problem in every possible way for impeach people/owners/other breeders to make the DNA and prove that someone did something wrong.
Years have passed and nothing has been done because of that, people keep poluting the breed with dangerous mixes with fake papers and nothing can be done. It's only you read the old topics about the kennels De La Louve Blanche and Crying Wolf to read a bit of what happened.

I was actually just going through the old threads yesterday. Such a shame that people put their own desires above what is best for a breed they pretend to love.

Laws here regarding breeding are becoming stricter and stricter. Actually a few long term breeders are being lost because its so much more difficult to have a litter.

For example I used to breed GSDs. There have been instances where breeders have been held accountable for a pups health. Same with selling "pure" dogs that are infact mixes.

If its found that you knew you were selling mixes but decieved the buyer and sold as pure at a much higher cost you could open yourself up to be sued. Especially if this caused the buyer extra costs that could be linked back to the lie.

Not a guarantee this will happen. The cases so far have been few and far between but this is the direction our country is heading in regards to breeding.

A shame but thats how its going to be.

My biggest fear is that someone will bring mixes here and market them as pure. Dogs with lesser temperaments and health. No health tests. Break the laws by not microchipping ect. Its a new breed. One that some people will react with fear to. This will end no doubt in breed restrictions or banning. This wont just effect this breed but anything that is similar. A few who rush in without thought will make it so no one will be able to enjoy these dogs.

If I ever get the chamce to import I know I will be on here reading back through all the old threads and annoying all of you with my questions to make sure I get good examples of the breed.

"Better to start with the best you can" - thats what the breeder of my foundation bitch told me. :)

Yes :( my fear here too... Not long off the dwa list and could head back there if things continue the way there seem to be going :( :(

Just heard that they may change the minimum number of days from 30 to 10 from approved countries! Thats much better for importing. I hope they do.

"Australia is not ready"

I do believe that this is an unfair statement. Certainly there are people who are not ready here, but I would argue that there are people all over the world (including where CZW's are available) who are "not ready" to own a vlack.

I'm sorry, Sona, that this seems to be your perception here. Obviously this is the attitude you have come across here. But please do not judge the whole country as not ready.

If I had the means and $$ to enable me to import a pair of good quality dogs here I certainly would. As it is, this is a long way from possible for me at this time in my life.

I'm involved in a number of other species forums (reptile, aquaria, feline) and the overwhelming thing I find is that people who are REALLY passionate about the animal/breed they keep are very protective of the breeding and keeping of that animal. And rightly so! But it is not fair to judge a whole country as being unable to make the right decisions for the breed - as mentioned, there seems to be people here and in Europe who are willing to mentor and help breeders here. We certainly must be grateful of that!

The breed is not widely known here. Perhaps once people begin learning of the breed, serious and responsible breeders will emerge who are dedicated preserving the lines developed in Europe.

The rest of us can only hope.

I think one at a time is more than enough! ;)

Haha I have no doubt! It would just seem such a waste to only bring one animal over with the costs of import etc

Well the two the we have from Mick are just over 5 months old now and they're great. In my eyes they look the Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs and I believe they are.

I've seen people on this forum say that Ravens Spirit only have ONE pure Czechoslovakian Wolfdog, who they breed to White Shepherds. Well if you know anything about genetics, you would know that their pups wouldn't look anything like Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs if that was the case.

For those who are so adamant that they're not pure, provide some evidence for once. So far no one has provided evidence.

Below are some pics of our 5 month old pups and I'm sure that some of you'll be happy to see that your speculations->(Who knows what characteristics might such a mix carry in his genes?! Pink coat and brown nose of a saarlos? Extreme shyness of a wolfdog hybrid? Maybe deep chest and falling top line of a GSD?") were false.




http://i49.tinypic.com/eqyxr9.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/httesi.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/k1xgcm.jpg

http://i50.tinypic.com/2vm7gwg.jpg

Good morning, yes, of course it is MY perception, whose else? I am presenting my point of view, as everyone else here. And this view IS based on my experience in Australia and what I can read here. And I used "Australia is not ready" as a figure of speech based on what I can see everyday, what people expect from dogs here and also on that immediate interest in the pups, no matter the origin. I think it is pretty clear that I did not talk in absolute terms. As Ina mentioned, it could have happened that the dogs were imported with the best intention and not knowing the background but after getting the information about the origin being unclear - why breeding? The fact that the pups look like CSW does not mean much. I really don't desire to start quarrels here. I would rather help those who dedicate all the efforts, time and funds to import pure CSWs in Australia and do their best to establish a good breeding base. At present I can't do it myself and I am getting a bit scared to see people shortcutting already (the dogs are here already, ok, questionable origin but there is not proof - let's breed, it's soo easy!). The dog breeders community and environment here in Australia in general looks to me very different to the one in Europe. It is more enclosed, not very welcoming for new people, let alone just fans and viewers, this atmosphere and the distances make new owners more separated. In general, people accept mixes of all kind much easier. And don't get me wrong here, there is nothing wrong with having a cross, any kind, might be the best companion ever. But for introducing a new breed, a good breeding base with reliable origin/background is essential. Establishing a well working community of CSW owners, developing into a breeders club sooner or later is another very important step - a club is not only a bunch of people meeting once in a while to have fun together (although that is one of very positive sides of a club life...), it is first of all the source of help and information, leadership and up the certain level also a warranty that the breed will be presented to public in the best ways - through the breeding selection, education of the new owners, publicity etc. Clubs will deal with and promote the pure individuals only. So what will happen with those where the origin is questionable? What else would they possibly cross with? Experimenting? Good, why not, but if anything goes wrong, it can result in lots of bans of the whole breed/s. CSW are not easy, we all know it (and love them for it!) and the pressure and restrictions are getting worse. Is that what we want to risk? Getting CSW banned before it could get known and popular here? Once again, there is plenty of reliable information about the breed and breeders in Europe and I believe also many breeders who wouldn't hesitate to help Australians who would like to start with CSW the right way. Although it is also competitive field, there are breeders that would even advise you to buy from different breeder, should they see it more suitable for establishing a new breeding base. I strongly recommend to everyone in Australia who is serious about having a CSW to get as much information upfront as possible, be patient and make a wise choice. A good breeder will give you pros as well as cons of the breed, it is good to know what you are going to deal with...:-) Good luck

Great post Sona - and you could be describing the situation in the UK too. Too many people in for making what they can with dogs or questionable lineage/temperament without a care for the furtherment (is that a word??) of the breed...

The fact that the the whole entire littler looks like Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs, can only mean one thing, they're pure. On genetic principals if they were mix bred there would be variation in the litter.

Facts are people have been trying to make out that anyone involved with these particular dogs are irresponsible, because you don't believe they're pure. But no one has provided proof.

Sorry but this only shows you know nothing at all about the materia and not very much about genetics and breeds.
Apart of this the two pups show a high variation. Maybe you should go and ask the breeder of Aargon Spirit of the Wolf what she thinks about the matter. I for example have never seen a pup out of this line with a bad mask.
White Shepherds don´t have the silly back of the normal ones, they are mostly lighter build, they are not supposed to have pink noses and where should the shyness come from crossing a shepherd with a CSV?
If a breeder only has one purebred dog but doesn´t use a dog from outside how is it gonna happen he can produce purebreds??
If the parents are purebreds which kennelclub signed the pedigrees?
And how do they look like? Which organisations have done the HD- and eyes-check on the parents of your couple? When did the parents of your couple get the official ok for breeding.
Sona is so very right.

Ina

What are your qualifications in genetics?

"Apart from this the two pups show a high variation" type "Czechoslovakian Wolfdog" into google and you will see Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs with high variation as well, but like my male and female pups you can identify them as Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs. The variation I was referring to is in mixed breed pups, some pups will lean towards Czechoslovakian Wolfdog, other pups will lean towards White Shepherds (or what ever they're mixed with).

"White Shepherds don´t have the silly back of the normal ones, they are mostly lighter build, they are not supposed to have pink noses and where should the shyness come from crossing a shepherd with a CSV?" Can't you see I put that statement in quotes?! I was quoting what someone else said my pups could possibly have, so tell that to them. Read the thread.

"If a breeder only has one purebred dog but doesn´t use a dog from outside how is it gonna happen he can produce purebreds??" Have you even seen the pedigree? because if you have, you would know that their lineage isn't all Ravens Spirit.

Just because a dog isn't registered with a particular organisation does not mean the dog isn't pure. Rest assured our dogs have been health checked, and don't exhibit HD or eye problems.

I passed the last exams for veterinary surgeon 1998 and work in small animals ever since. This exam includes animal breeding with of course genetics. To get there I had to get degrees in Zoology and Biochemistry.
I own wolfdogs since 1997, breed them since 2000, have a FCI/VDH kennel called Zlata Palz, have visited the countries of origin inclusiv the club shows, bonitations and summer camps since 1998. I have assisted on several Bonitations, have organized several Club shows, am one of the founders of the first German Club and at the moment one of the heads.

Sona by the way has studied Biology, been involved in the breeding since decades and is a specialized judge for Bonitations and Shows of the Slowakian Club for CSV.
If you mix a part CSV with a pure CSV it is not very likely you will find White Shepherd like dogs in the first generations, especially as dark color normally is dominant and the exterieur is so very close. Also the White Shepherds have their origin in the normal German Shepherd. And I don´´t need to google them as I know several hundreds in life.

I know their lineage isn´t all Ravens Spirit. In Germany breeding without pedigree on purpose is a reliable sign for people that don´t want to undergo the controles of the German Kennel Club and follow the rules and there are quite a lot, like controles of HD and inherited eye disease and home and knowlege of the breeder.
The German kennel club also would have asked for proofe of the parentage in this case at it is well known in Germany that they cannot be pure.
But this is goona be a little bit silly, breeding is something very different to what Ravens Spirit or you are doing.

Ina

Ok, we'll let's see. One, my generation of pups is at least f3, so you clearly haven't even being reading the thread. So given they're f3, if there was white shepherd in them, you would definitely be seeing that in some of the litter.

Another thing, look at eyes for example. Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs eyes range from amber to brown. White Shepherds have brown eyes. Brown eyes are dominant. Therefore how can you get multiple pups in the f3 generation showing amber eyes, when both the f2 generation had brown eyes? All it means is the f2 must of being carrying amber eyes, from the Czechoslovakian Wolfdog. If there was a white shepherd in there, it would be highly unlikely that you would get amber eyed pups, given brown is dominant and amber only comes from the Czechoslovakian Wolfdog.

Well given you've seen hundreds of Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs, surely you'd understand that there is a large amount of variation in them. My two do not have all that much, apart from being different genders of course.

They do have a pedigree, so what do you mean by "breeding without pedigree on purpose?"

"breeding is something very different to what Ravens Spirit or you are doing." Ignorance again, I'm not breeding I've made it very clear. My two pups are desexed. Read before you make these statements. Secondly, so you're an expert on Ravens Spirit? Mind sending me some pictures of the White Shepherd mixes you say they use for breeding?

no, it doesn't mean that they aren't pure, but it means they shouldn't have been bred without slovak club approval... and 5 month old puppies normally don't show any congenital health problems anyway.

I'm curious as to why you disagree with the owners of your puppies' parents, who in a previous post believes the male is a mix? Or does she no longer think that?