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Living with a CzW.... Stories as forewarnings for future owners.... everything about the character of Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs

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Old 08-05-2010, 20:17   #21
Gypsy Wolf
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Lupis, as for my girlfriend's choice of Crying Wolf, that was HER decision, not mine. I introduced her to the breed, she did some research - including looking at the bonitation of the dam, and decided she liked the sire so much, she was willing to risk sharpness. She is also a long-time working-line Malinois person, so sharpness is something she LIKES. A little "skitziness" or "nervy" behavior is common in Malinois and not something that bothers her.
She wanted a vlcak that would be flashy in competitive obedience and liked to bite. Edgy behavior was not a worry for her. In fact, she sort of feels that such behavior often goes hand in hand with the ultra-sensitivity and reactiveness she likes to see in a flashy dog.
I fully trust her ability to work with just about any temperament, and of course the final decision is hers.
Personally, I much prefer going to the breeder's home and seeing parents for myself. Though I did trust a good friend to select an import GSD for me, sight-unseen. My girlfriend was comfortable with Edit sending her the puppy sight-unseen. Again, her call.
So we'll see how it goes. So far the puppy has greatly surprised her with his resilience to all the stress he's gone through during a serious period in development.
And really, I know a LOT of Malinois breeders - show and working lines. I don't know ANY that have had a "perfect record" when it comes to temperament. There are often fruitloops produced in the breed, regardless of how careful you are. Vlcaks are similar in many ways to Malinois. With Edit's number of litters produced in her many years, no doubt a few fruitloops crop up from time to time. You can't help it breeding the kind of temperament the breed has.
I would bet if you bred a few litters you would see that for yourself. It happens.
So don't get a puppy from Crying Wolf - your choice. Just as it was my friend's choice to do so. I respect your opinion - you have said your piece. Now I would appreciate your respect as well - criticizing a newbie is not really such a good way to welcome them into the breed. Educating them is.
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Old 09-05-2010, 11:30   #22
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Rona, dogs are different like we people. I like dogs who are able to work but I do not go in dog clubs or places and train them there. It is enough for me to work by myself with them and sometimes a few times a year I go and it is enough for me. I am not a friend of this. I am a friend of taking part in events like the Pro Evolution contest where man and his best friend the wolfdog work!

The society changes in europe (the world) and we do not need dogs who will be trained for biting. A few weeks ago I got to know people who have to Malinois and they are training them, they are taking part at the german champion ship next weekend. But they are not able to lead their dog without this horrible pinch/prong collar.

I know lots of dogs, who are "good" on their training ground in their club but outside it is a complete different world, they do not listen, they behave not normal. Sorry, for me it is important that the dogs are outside in the world good and not on training ground.

I do not like dogs which I pass in summercamp and they try to snap at me. Dogs which are trained. Even from people who are writing here.

There are dogs which it is better not to train. But people train them and then the result is that they try to snap everyone who is passing them.

To see if a dog has working abilities you do not need to pass examines.

It is my opinion. I respect yours.

Christian
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Old 09-05-2010, 19:44   #23
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Rona, dogs are different like we people. I like dogs who are able to work but I do not go in dog clubs or places and train them there. (...)
I fully understand you. We too, train Lorka only for fun and don't feel like taking any exams. She passes them every day in the streets, buses, at our friends homes, etc. and we find it sufficient.

But you wrote that dogs "must not" take exams! Must not in English means that they are forbidden to take them, so you statement made no sense to me.

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The society changes in europe (the world) and we do not need dogs who will be trained for biting. A few weeks ago I got to know people who have to Malinois and they are training them, they are taking part at the german champion ship next weekend. But they are not able to lead their dog without this horrible pinch/prong collar.

I know lots of dogs, who are "good" on their training ground in their club but outside it is a complete different world, they do not listen, they behave not normal. Sorry, for me it is important that the dogs are outside in the world good and not on training ground.
I fully agree.

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I do not like dogs which I pass in summercamp and they try to snap at me. Dogs which are trained. Even from people who are writing here.
There are dogs which it is better not to train. But people train them and then the result is that they try to snap everyone who is passing them.
The fact that somebody is training a dog doesn't necessarily mean the dog has been already trained succesffuly What's more, vlcaks are not machines, they are able to "think" independently and let me repeat again: I belive the breed has been designed to teach their owners modesty and make them feel humble from time to time. Personally, I love this particular trait of them! But since no owner knows what his dog might 'do' one day I would suggest less critical approach to other vlcaks.

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To see if a dog has working abilities you do not need to pass examines.
Well, yes and no. It's true one does not need to pass exams to see if the dog has an aptitude for work, but if their breeder claims on-line that he/she is breeding 'working lines' he/she should be able to prove it. Such breeders should select owners who would be willing to train their pups, pass exams with them and only then will the breeder turn credible

There are so many 'virtual working dogs', 'virtual big dogs', virtual beautifully moving dogs', 'virtual good characters', etc. etc.! If these statements are not confirmed officially by bonitation codes, passed exams and show results they may just be fancies of "proud parents" or smart PR of business-oriented breeders
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Old 10-05-2010, 09:20   #24
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I'm so happy that after the trouble , little Pollux arrived his new home and his is fine!

About Lupis : as he never sign his comments and always just attacing everybody , of course not his oppinion is authoritative. Especial to see the fact that he has never seen the dogs he is talking about!No worth to deal with his comments more!

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Old 10-05-2010, 15:44   #25
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What's done is done; Luna's mom's friend has a new puppy, so let's be happy for her. Whether or not it pans out as a working dog or just a very much loved pet doesn't matter to the dog.

Let's be happy for her friend. Maybe her puppy will be the rare dog out of lines not known for working.

Arguments based on if a person has seen, or not seen, specific kennels' dogs are pretty much irrelevant; if the kennel has a record of producing working dogs, there is no need to defend itself.. the evidence speaks for itself.
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Old 10-05-2010, 18:58   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yukidomari View Post
What's done is done; Luna's mom's friend has a new puppy, so let's be happy for her. Whether or not it pans out as a working dog or just a very much loved pet doesn't matter to the dog.

Let's be happy for her friend. Maybe her puppy will be the rare dog out of lines not known for working.

Arguments based on if a person has seen, or not seen, specific kennels' dogs are pretty much irrelevant; if the kennel has a record of producing working dogs, there is no need to defend itself.. the evidence speaks for itself.
Agree, and I think this puppy will be a working dog even if not from a working dog kennel... But if not, I hope the pressure on him is not to high, if he just likes to be a pet Vlcak I think one is not to say, this puppy will be the first IPO champion of the Vlcak breed in the USA, even before he is born

And just for the record this was Lunas mom´s friends Mrs X choice of kennel, I did newer hear Edit say or write she breed working dogs, I only did say that if I’m looking for a working dog I do not look for a dog from her kennel...

And yes...

Congratulation to your new puppy Mrs X and I’m happy that he is good after the hard trip

Best regards / Mikael
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Old 10-05-2010, 22:25   #27
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Thank you all for your support. I am happy to say the puppy is getting better every day. I visited them yesterday so Luna and Pollux (the only 2 vlcaks in the Deep South!) could play. It's interesting that vlcaks really do recognize their own breed and behave differently.
Poor Pollux had gotten terrible diarrhea from the stress and probably whatever crap he had been fed in transit and it took him a couple of days for his poor tummy to settle down and for his true personality to start coming through. He is snuggling, playing with toys, retrieving and getting used to the crate.
He even got to sleep in bed with his new mom.
So, yes, he is going to be a loved pup and hopefully a super working one...
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Old 11-05-2010, 20:24   #28
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And last night Pollux came out to our dog club for some socialization. Of course everyone loved him. He is quiet and watches everything intently.
He actually likes being held like a baby and snuggling - so cute...
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Old 11-05-2010, 21:29   #29
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So watch out, that you do not confirm shyness. If it is only quietness, ok. It is a pup and must have a look at the new situation. But it would be better if he walks around in curiousity. But I guess you know that.
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Old 11-05-2010, 21:42   #30
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No worries on that score - my girlfriend is an excellent trainer, and is well-known for turning out confident, happy working dogs.
He is curious about things he watches - particularly anything that moves...
and is super communicating with other dogs, too.
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Old 11-05-2010, 22:32   #31
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So watch out, that you do not confirm shyness. If it is only quietness, ok.
you have wolfdogs but you have no idea about your breed and what is shyness.
shy reaction by young dogs is normal. also if dog not socialized is shy is normall too. if dog not like someting is also typical wolfdog.
real shy dog is dog when you socialize and work and work but is not better and character still not good.
shy puppy or shy young dog is not problem. i knwo many CLC where were not confident as pups but later very good working dogs. problem is shy puppy and later shy adult dog with not possible to chage it.
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Old 12-05-2010, 02:52   #32
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Welcome Pollux!! Thanks for the updates, Luna's Mom. Glad to hear that all are adjusting accordingly.

Rona, I have to agree wholeheartedly with your belief that "the CSV breed is designed to teach their owners modesty and make them feel humble from time to time." I also believe that is why many of us love this breed so much!

Whether or not a particular CSV develops into a 'working' dog, it is almost certain that all CSV's will make sure that their owners will be a 'working' owner.
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Old 12-05-2010, 03:34   #33
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Yes, they certainly do teach us humility. They are not like any other breed I have trained. The way they perceive their world, how they learn and their incredible memory.
Pollux is developing beautifully - as is Luna. It is very interesting to watch them as they grow. Pollux is a very serious cookie - very attached to his mom, whereas Luna is a little more independent. I expect that is part of gender differences in character. Luna is my "partner" and Pollux is her "boyfriend"...
I am so thrilled my girlfriend fell in love with the breed, too. Kind of nice to have another vlcak owner to compare notes with...
It seems that we have both experienced similar public reaction to our vlcaks - people are always attracted and ooh and aah over them and are convinced once the general public sees the breed it will become popular...
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Old 12-05-2010, 08:35   #34
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Whether or not a particular CSV develops into a 'working' dog, it is almost certain that all CSV's will make sure that their owners will be a 'working' owner.
Bravo! I like this sentence VERY much, because it is sooooo true.
Not long ago our trainer half jokingly has said, that having such a dog is a sport in itself, there's no need to do anything else. And this is truth also, because in fact we even don't have time for other sports and pastimes apart from those connected with our dog.
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Old 13-05-2010, 00:24   #35
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An update on Pollux - he is getting better and better everyday... unfortunately, due to Delta putting him in a strange kennel for 2 nights during his ordeal, poor pup has kennel cough...
Delta will certainly be hearing from us about that. And their whole "reason" was protecting the U.S. from disease? I guess it didn't work the other way around...
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Old 13-06-2010, 21:24   #36
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Hi,
any news concerning Pollux?
Is he well again? Is your friend still happy having this pup?
Hoping for the best...
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Old 14-06-2010, 04:06   #37
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Pollux is indeed an interesting little boy. Different in many ways than my Luna. He is totally interested in his human - to the extent that he will ignore other dogs/people. He does like other dogs, though, and feels comfortable around them. People he doesn't know he has absolutely no interest in.
Like Luna he is a "force of nature" in the house... my girlfriend mentioned his zooming around the house, grabbing everything including the flip-flop sandal off her foot and running off with it gleefully.
He, of course, is going through the typical puppy vlcak behavior - if something spooks him, he will dart to something he considers familiar. Luna did the same thing at the same age and has since outgrown it.
He is a very serious cookie - not submissive in the least and even a little willful.
She is an excellent dog trainer, though, so he couldn't have gone to a better place. I can't imagine the Average American tolerating his quirks - not to mention his gripping everything in sight.
He swims in the pool, which is adorable to watch as he always swims to his "mom"... his bond with her is strong.
When I have brought Luna over for a play date Pollux gets totally annoyed by her - his facial expressions are hilarious.
I'll keep you posted - it's nice to have another vlcak around. Last Monday we went to a local dog club to train and there was a guy there from the Czech republic who knew exactly what Luna and Pollux were. He said his grandmother lived near the border and growing up he saw the vlcaks and their handlers patrolling all the time. He said they even had a Vlcak head as the design on their uniform epaulets. So it was neat to hear about them from someone who saw them working.
I am so glad I decided to take a risk and join the CsV world...
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