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Breeding Information about breeding, selection, litters.... |
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29-11-2009, 10:31 | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Bad Dürkheim
Posts: 2,249
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Wilczy Omen Kennel
Hi,
I'm just wondering what the breeding regulations in Poland like, since I noticed the following, upcoming litter. www.wolfdog.org/deu/litters/1085.html Is it just an experiment to use a dog with such a bad hip score ( HD-D) or is there any other important reason using this bitch? It can't be this especial mating, since we have loads of descendands from their ancestors. Thanks, Michael |
29-11-2009, 12:09 | #2 | ||
Dziad Borowy
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Puppies will be sold as pets (not for breeding) to owners from Poland only. Anarchia will be sterilized.
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There is no reality -- only our own order imposed on everything. Basic Bene Gesserit Dictum |
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29-11-2009, 15:13 | #3 | |
VIP Member
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Krzyq-do you want to SELL the puppies??? |
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29-11-2009, 17:47 | #4 |
Moderator
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Sold as Pet normally means sell at cost price ( vaccines, deworming and so).
I'm glad that different of some breeders you had honesty to show the real results of your dog to the world, while you could perfectly search for a different vet, in different country and make one acceptable result like C or even A, as we know some cases even on very famous studs.
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Last edited by Nebulosa; 29-11-2009 at 18:11. |
29-11-2009, 18:31 | #5 | |
Dziad Borowy
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People, who are interested in puppies of Anarchia and Jabber, was informed of her HD. We talked with them as soon as we had official result. We have put information about her score on our website and in WD database. We don't lie to them that everything is ok. This is theirs decision if they still want puppy. We think that someone, who has to pay for a dog, thinks more careful then if it is for free. We didn't write anywhere that puppies will be sold for regular price.
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We know that this mating shouldn't happen. We wouldn't allow it, If we had any clue that Anarchia is sick. We took our lesson. Now we're doing our best to put puppies in good hands.
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There is no reality -- only our own order imposed on everything. Basic Bene Gesserit Dictum |
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29-11-2009, 18:49 | #6 | |
Scandinavian Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 1,089
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Very sorry for the D result. Good luck whit the puppy´s anyway, I hope you find good responsible owners. Very best regards / Mikael
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_________________________________________________ *Hronec, Rasty, Zilja * Kennel, Wolfdog of Sweden* http://kennelwolfdogofsweden.vpsite.se/Home.html
Last edited by Mikael; 29-11-2009 at 18:53. |
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29-11-2009, 20:28 | #7 |
ir Brukne
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Maybe it would be good to ask the new owners of pups to sterilize them too?.. You know how people buy dogs "not for breeding", but later change their minds... And also dogs without pedigrees come in that way...
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29-11-2009, 20:29 | #8 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Bad Dürkheim
Posts: 2,249
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Hi,
thanks for your frank answer. I didn't want to accuse you openly, I was just curious about that case. The steps you have planned now show real responsibility to me. But the real shame actually is on the Polish Kennel Club who doesn't require any hip scores at all. Good luck for you and your puppies. Regards, Michael |
29-11-2009, 21:13 | #9 | |
Senior Member
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Wouldn't happen in Italy...I'm sure... I don't think that there are many countries like germany that forbid pedigree to displasic dog mateings, also Italian national kennel club doesn't care who parents are, they can even be brothers or father and mother and displasic, as long as they pay their quota for the pedigrees. massimo
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---------- Oliver & Lunatica Last edited by massimo; 29-11-2009 at 21:17. |
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30-11-2009, 00:31 | #10 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Warnsveld
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@ Krzyg: I have respect for your honesty and openness!
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Vriendelijke groeten, Mijke PS: I am not a moderator anymore!! |
30-11-2009, 01:06 | #11 |
Wilczasty : Foto
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Sorry but the club will not change anything on the HD. at the moment this is unrealistic in poland
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Brązowa Odznaka Honorowa Związku Kynologicznego w Polsce Braterstwo Wilczaków Galeria |
30-11-2009, 23:10 | #12 | |||
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Sold as pet could also means the obligation of neuther the pup independant of the results of this litter. I would make a little bit different in this case: I would gave or sold by cost price the puppies with a normal pedigree in my name, legally the pups will be at my own and it will be pretty clear explained in one strong contract. - The pedigree of the puppies would stay in MY name and in MY OWN, all owners would took the puppies but without put the hands in the papers. - all owners must make the X rays of ED and HD and officialize the results. Depending of the results the owner must neuther the dog, sending me a receipt of it for proof the sterelization, in this case I would send him the pedigree, passed for his name and let clear in the papers that this dog is not for breeding. If the dog is Ok, so I would stay with the dog in co-ownership with the owner ( my and his name in the papper), and if someone want to use it for breeding ( in the case of a stud male), I would judge if it would be wise or not looking at the line of both dogs for HD, in the case of females I would only allow to use her if it be strictly necessary, what I think and hope it will never be. Argo made some puppies with bad HD, some of his puppies also will not be used in breeding because his owners are not breeders and I have no idea about the results that will have the brothers of Anarchia and there is the point I see. Anarchia by Argo its common because Argo was already well used, but with her mother Enya its a different history, the conection that made Enya ( Dak x Hera) is very interessing, but was a litter with few puppies, Eja I dont have idea where is she and about her results, Aros is in France and got C results in France, but if I remember well a long time ago on French forum someone wrote that he got A in his orign country, after make again the results, he only mate Astrale Les plaines de L'est which looking at the line of Astrale and her brothers and taking it in consideration I find he made very good puppies. Its well known some cases of interessing mates which the puppies simply had disapeared or the owners we are able to contact have dogs that are not able to mate ( because the age or by the fact that the owner neuthered the dog, also we can see cases of dogs that simply dont make puppies), and because of it the blood of whole litter if still didn't disappeared are in path to it happen. So, I would neuther the unhealty dogs, but let the healty ones in my guard for, if strictly needed, use it with a lot of care. After all, we dont know the future, now this line its more common and we have some young dogs with the blood of Enya and Argo, but in more 8 years, will it be?
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Last edited by Nebulosa; 30-11-2009 at 23:18. |
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01-12-2009, 10:18 | #13 | ||
złośliwy krasnolud
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 705
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I just wonder how breeder can enforce: Quote:
And for me it's huge f##up, and growing in size as I resemble how sssmok were writing that hers breeding will be made according to all rules like in slovakia etc. I see this like this: They want to have litter after Jabber - he has BOG, BOBs, and other trophies and Anarchia Ľalinok - she has nothing to be outstanding or just to be proud of. Anarchia doesn't have joints RTG so breeders make it but fails to have official results of RTG and when its time for mating they do it without results. And as always in such cases 's## hits the fan' and now its only cleaning the mess.
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CIRI Wilk z Polskiego Dworu ['] |
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01-12-2009, 15:20 | #14 | |||||
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When you breed dogs mainly you will depend of owners good will, that's why the breeders ever try to select maximaly as possible the owner.
If the good will of the owner dont be "such good" in the worst case you can use the law and rights for the contract be respected, that's why the contract exist. Quote:
The owner will brake the contract, and the breeder will need to enter in the justice, there the contract will be really used. The second option is sterilize the female puppies while they're still small, before go to the new owners house. To tell you the truth I agreed with this metod of early sterilization before, untill some dogs and cats early sterilized (included 2 of my cats here) start to show health problems that can be related with it after some age, without count sometimes the complet loose of sexual distinction for males, and extended growth for both. He can put on contract the sterilization and even like it he wil depend of owners good will again. No doubts, the best is select better as possible the owners because wanting or not, you will depend of his good will even for threat the dog properly. Quote:
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01-12-2009, 16:24 | #15 | |
Call Me Sexy Srdcervac
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19.11 x-rays by local vet 26.11 date on official document-result by phone 01.12 owner get dokuments to hands. but it can be much longer (polish Post ) |
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