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Old 07-06-2006, 11:37   #1
BeatriceSlavinschi
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Default Do you know more about living with wolves?

Hi everybody!

I wonder if anybody knows more about living with wolves because I have the opportunity to work with a 2 years female. My husband also worked with her, but she changed her attitude after the heat period. They were best friends until the heat period, when she mated with a Czech wolfdog. Till then my husband was considered the alpha male and she was obedient. After she realized that the Czech male was her pair she tried to drive my husband away, from her territory I suppose. She's more insistent and there are days when my husband can't approach to her paddock. We used to let her play with the wolfdog, on a 2000 square meters territory; she was so social, like a dog. Now she plays only with me and my husband must stay away. I think this is a hierarchy problem and we must re-establish it, but how?

Thanks for reading my message and I hope to hear from you soon.

Regards,
Beatrice.
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Old 07-06-2006, 16:18   #2
herder
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Ask Jim en Jamie Dutcher, they spend six years living with wolves in the wild. There documentarie is "Living with wolves"

Contact info must be found on the net or e-mail the discovery channel!

Why you did crossbreed a wolf with a wolfdog??
I noticed that you are a biologi-student, is it for research?

Regards,
Bert.
(Netherlands)
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Old 07-06-2006, 22:12   #3
Nebulosa
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Why you have make this? and in what this crosse could serve to improve the breed?
And the pupies, what was the destiny of then?




I not have find one much good moctive for have make this, for the 2, the breed and the wolves, are to much better you cross this she-wolf with other wolf pure, or she aren't one pure wolf, are one Hibryd high content ( too common in the USA for sell)?

Really, have many WOlfHibryds looking for a new home because they have one hard caracter, you can find too much high content wolfhibryds, like 98% wolf , this is pratically a wolf...

WolfHibryds, you as a biologist has know, is one big problem for the wolf specie in the EUA, I believe that in europe too.

best regards

Paula
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Old 08-06-2006, 14:54   #4
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I do not understand, why you let the she-wolf to mate with CSW. What will be with the pups? Producing wolf-hybrids will only bring troubles and make cast a shadow on the breed as such. I could understand if it is for some research, but even then it is highly risky thing and should be done only by experienced people and under a strict and reasonable plan. But then, experienced people would know how to deal with their animals, right?

I do not think the Dutchers would be of any help.
You might try to contact these people in Belgium:

Centre d’Accueil et d’Etudes des loups ASBL
La Moutarde 13
4831 Bilstain-Limbourg
Tel : 00 32 (0)87 65 29 50 (Néerlandais)
E-mail : [email protected] (Néerlandais)
Homepage : www.wolves.be
GSM : 0479/ 60 23 59 (Français)
E-mail : [email protected] (Français)
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Old 09-06-2006, 15:20   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirkawolf1
I do not understand, why you let the she-wolf to mate with CSW.
Mirka, you're absolutely right! I wonder why so few CSVs owners reacted to this post!

No wonder some people in some countries percieve CSV owners as wild ecologists who dream of further matching of CSVs with wolves to breed more and more dangerous hybrids.

I belive such "experiments" (if not carried out by a qualified scientific team in specially designed conditions with all possible problems anticipated and funds provided) as particulary noxious for the CSV breed. It might lead to:
1. the hybrid pups suffering (does the 'pseudobreeder' know what will happen to them?)
2. adult animals' and human suffering (it is clearly stated in the first post that things have already got out of hand)
3. harm done to the breed. E.g. the post may be used by DEFRA clerks to show what will happen if CSVs are allowed in the UK or Norway!

I belive CSV owners should jointly condemn such practices and irresponsible behaviour! It might eventually result in the breed devastation and further formation of stupid stereotypes about CVSs owners and breeders...
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Old 09-06-2006, 19:19   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rona
I wonder why so few CSVs owners reacted to this post!

No wonder some people in some countries percieve CSV owners as wild ecologists who dream of further matching of CSVs with wolves to breed more and more dangerous hybrids.
Rona, I absolutely agree with you- but...

-there will always be stupid people doing stupid things
-it happend so it is kind of useless to discuss it at this point
-it is more important to help these animals and their "breeder"
-they asked for help and if you can provide help you should not hesitate


Quote:
Originally Posted by Rona

I belive CSV owners should jointly condemn such practices and irresponsible behaviour! It might eventually result in the breed devastation and further formation of stupid stereotypes about CVSs owners and breeders...
Most CSV owners sure do so (I hope ), but does it change anything? All WE can do, is to inform people open and honest about our breed. But we are not responsible for every other wolf or any other human being - We can say listen, I do not like what you are doing, but thats about it.

Do you have any idea how to help Beatrice? I have no experience with hybrids so I cannot help her, but maybe someone here is able to help.

And this means more effort than asking why did you do this....
Fortunately some other readers gave her some contacts already.

I think all CSV owners love wolves. And all CSV owners have their own reason to have a CSV instead of a wolf. We all should support wolves and dogs and help people whenever they have a prob with their animal- if we can. Only if people have enough and correct information about the breeds they can make a right decision (for the animal).

Regards,
Kerstin
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Old 09-06-2006, 22:30   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kerstin
-they asked for help and if you can provide help you should not hesitate
Unfortunately, I can't but if only I could I wouldn't hesitate to help.... Nevertheless, help is one thing, and the attitude to the whole matter - another!

Lots of wolf lovers visit this site and this is not the first time someone has had the idea of matching CSVs with wolves. I think it should be clear what people who care about the breed think of such projects and their effects, despite the help they provide.

Mixing CSV with wolves contributes to the formation of unfair stereotypes about CSV breeders and causes that work and efforts of such people as Paul or Per Olav might be carried out in vain.

What's surprising is the fact that the "breeder" does not even seem to realise that she did something... unwise (to put it mildly)!
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Old 10-06-2006, 00:56   #8
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Dear Beatrice, somehow your husband makes mistakes and the wolf doesn"t thrust him. That's why she does not want him arount when mating. Posible that she learn't that by thretning him she hat succes. Obvious the wolf senses that your husband isn't self assured. But i wunder if it was a good idear to use the wolf so young or to use her anyway. It wil bring hybrides that wil not be able to held as a dog. The chance is there that some pups later on wil be killed. Did you ask your self if this was a good plan at all? I hope next time you don't breed with the wolf. I now howe it ends mostly. I live with wolfdogs and with some wolfs. I run an wolf resque and are often asked for help. Mostly to late. Believe me, not many of the hybrides will live a long live. Not many people are able to give them what they need. So please don't do this again.
Jos de Bruin
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Old 10-06-2006, 02:38   #9
BeatriceSlavinschi
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Hello,

I’m feeling obliged to you to give you some details.
Ok. We took this wolf from a zoological garden, where she was putted in a small cage, with improper conditions for living. She was aggressed when she was a pup, because she has a missing eye and a dislocated joint. So we speak there to transfer her to us, where we set her afoot (she was so skinny….). She was an adult when we took her last year, so I think she’s at least two years, maybe three; nobody gave us details. We had a Czech male and we thought it will be a good idea if they become friends, because she looked so lost……. They liked each other and become best friends. We changed her life to something she hasn’t ever dreamed of, we taught her what happiness means, because she didn’t know.
So I admit it was a mistake to let them mate, but it happened. The good thing is that they do not have pups, because this happened only once and the 64 days have gone.
Ok. I know I’ve done a mistake and it won’t happen in the future. I’m not even a breeder. I just have a male and love wolves and I think I have saved her life, taking her from that place, because I’m sure she had to be put to sleep.
I think some of you are overreacting. People make mistakes, but if you talk to them nicely instead of putting them to the wall, it’s more efficient.
Thanks Kerstin for your point of view. I appreciate your sincerity and kindness.
After I will graduate I want to make a shelter for orphan wolves that can not be reintroduced.

Thanks everyone for your advice.
Beatrice.
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Old 10-06-2006, 08:47   #10
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Beatrice, it's a pity you did not provide the setting and describe the whole story in your first post, because it puts the whole issue in a different light. As I said earlier, many wolf lovers visit this site and they shouldn't gain the impression that CSV owners/ breeders conduct and support "experiments" such as yours.

I found an institution in Poland that might help you:

Mammal Research Institute
Polish Academy of Sciences
ul. Waszkiewicza 1c
17-230 Bialowieza
phone +48 85 682 77 50 / fax +48 85 682 77 52
The person repsonsible for the coordination of a project resaerch concerning wolves - Prof. Dr Włodzimierz Jędrzejewski [email protected]
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Old 10-06-2006, 12:11   #11
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Sorry Beatrice you feld beïng put to the wall. But it sounded as if some one just breeded hybrides and fouled around with the chech. wolfdog breed. And my experiënce with how this mostly ends, the hybrides i mean. Did not put me in an good mood. I had to kil a 3/4wolf with my own hand while some stupid ash... put this animal in an no chanch situation. This is the raesen why i feel it as my duty to stand up for them. And if you want ta start a shelter for wolves you will find out that people do not like wolves. Here you find wolf friends, but out there most people hate them and think they eat granny's and children. But i allready like you for taking care of you wolf. I hope she is gonna thrust you husband. When she did in the beginning there most have happened some thing, try to find out what. May be she had a bad experience with man. Do you now how she lost here eye? And with one year age they are still behaving like a pup. So may be she is older as you think. Strange they didn't give any information. But good luck with your wolf. Buy
Jos de Bruin
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Old 10-06-2006, 14:58   #12
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Hello Beatrice,
thank you for the explanations. It all looks much better now and makes more sense. I am also sorry for being quite strict, but that is because there is so many irresponsible people, who do just this and other crazy things with our breed!
The address I gave you for the Centre d’Accueil et d’Etudes des loups ASBL might be really interesting for you. It is Centre for rescuing wolves from just such places, from where you saved your she-wolf. So if you plan to start something like that, you really should try to talk to them. I have no idea if they speak English though.
Or try the man, who howls with wolves - Werner Freund. The contact site is here: http://www.wolfspark.com/ He is in Germany and has waste experiences with living with wolves.

Good luck.

Mirka
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Old 10-06-2006, 17:43   #13
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Werner and Englisch? But it's simple, i'm willing and speak Englisch(i try) ,now the trouble you run into when you start keeping wolves. And i live together with wolves. And i studiyed theyr behavour. I have not the experience as Werner Freund but that has no one in the world. But i am easy to reach. But i tell you its not simple. You must be raedy to invest and offer a lot. It's not only cuddeling puppy's. I do agree it's a fine experience to be able to live with wolves. But you need also some licenses. In Germany it's not simple, harder as i first thouth. For new commers imposible. But in your country it is may be easyer.
gr Jos
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