Czechoslovakian vlcak club uk
 

Hello everyone :)

following the formation of the Czechoslovakian Vlcak Club of USA, we would like to inform you about the creation of the Czechoslovakian Vlcak Club of the UK. The Club is just forming, we have a lot to do, but our first goal is to get the breed registred with the British Kennel Club and to give it hope of a good new future in the UK

the group hope they will get support from wd forum members.

http://www.vlcak.co.uk/

(the site is still under construction)

I like :) :) :)

bloody good work

This is a great step forwards for the breed in this country :)

Hope the project will change the so far unfortunate history of CSV breed in the UK.8)

I'll keep my fingers crossed for your sucess :) Should you need any help or support, you may count on me. :)

Good luck! :fingers1

Looks good.

How do you get the breed registred with the British Kennel Club when their are no breeders solely dedicated to breed???

Looks like we don't need them, but hope they will join with time

Fantastic work. We will se quality breeding in UK very soon. ;-)

double post

I trust Marron from my kennel, who recently has arrived in the UK will contribute to register the breed in the UK :)

I'll follow the activities of the club and keep my fingers crossed for you guys!!! :)

Good luck!!!!:klatsch

It will not happen overnight but the group is working towards recognition by setting up a Breed Club and laying down strict guidelines to be followed. It is hoped that only FCI registered dogs will be used in future breeding programmes and even then, not until the breed is KC recognised. For recognition, you do not need actual breeders who are currently breeding, just good, pure, healthy, unrelated animals which will ensure the viability and progression of the breed in the future. Too few animals will lead to inbreeding, so the KC have set a number of 20 unrelated traceable animals before recognition can be achieved.

The group has my full support and that of many other people on the continent.

Good Luck everyone - we're going to need it :P

Oh, and we are open to new members joining at any time - as long as you agree to and abide by the guidelines :)

The more genuine breed lovers and protectors we can get involved, the better - no need to actually own a CsV at the moment, just enthusiasm and a desire to see things done properly - with the welfare of the breed foremost - is all that is needed :)

Good work!
Good luck! :Rose

Great work!!!!

Import register
 

Imported Breed Register Policy

1. Applications for recognition of breeds
The Committee will consider an application for recognition of a breed once there are specimens of it resident in the UK and the dog(s) are imported from a country either having a Kennel Club with which there is a reciprocal agreement or which has full membership of the F.C.I. or where there is a Breed Club maintaining a Stud Book and acceptable to the Kennel Club. Application for recognition and subsequent registration should be made in the first instance to the Breed Standards and Stud Book Sub-Committee. In general, an application should consist of:

• Names & addresses of UK owners/importers
• Total number of dogs of the breed in the UK [ideally at least 20, preferably unrelated]
• Copies of pedigrees of UK dogs – at least 3 generations
• Proposed breeding plan and indication of available gene pool
• Indication of temperament and characteristics
• Recognition status in the country of origin
• Details of registration body in country of origin
• Indication of group classification
• If the breed has been crossbred, when the registry closed
• Brief history of the breed in its country of origin & photographs
• Functionality of breed and how widely it is used
• Breed Standard from country of origin
• Breed Registration statistics in country of origin [ideally a consistent minimum of 50 per year]; and other countries
• Show entry statistics in country of origin and at international level [ideally a minimum of 35 individually exhibited at a single competitive event]
• Details of any inherited conditions prevalent in the breed
• For Working Breeds – details of activities. Video footage [if available]

Please note that it is the individual responsibility of those applying for breed recognition to ensure due compliance with all statutory and regulatory requirements, including requisite licences, permissions and consents as are laid down by the general law, with regard to the keeping, breeding and selling of any particular breed. Recognition of the breed by the Kennel Club will not denote that any of the above has been satisfied or complied with.
Recognition of a breed allows registration on the Imported Breeds Register, although the breed would not be eligible for exhibition until such time as an Interim Breed Standard is published. This is not considered at the same time as recognition, as it is the Kennel Club’s policy to allow the breed to develop slowly before show participation is permitted. Importers of new breeds are encouraged to form a provisional breed club, registration of which can be applied for once a certain nucleus of the breed has been established in the UK.

2. Eligibility for competition
Immediately the dog is accepted on the Imported Breed Register it can be entered and compete in Kennel Club Working Trials, Obedience, Agility and Flyball competitions. These dogs are also permitted to make ‘not for competition’ entries at shows.
Entry and competition at other Kennel Club licensed events for dogs on the Imported Breed Register is limited to Imported Breed Register classes, matches and exemption dog shows, and then only after an Interim Breed Standard has been approved by the Committee and PUBLISHED in the Kennel Gazette. Winners of Imported Breed Register classes are not eligible for group or best in show competition.
Immediately a breed is accepted on the Imported Breed Register, a dog of that breed can be entered and compete in Kennel Club Gundog Working Tests. Competition in Field Trials is subject to General Committee approval.

3. Production of an Interim Breed Standard
When there are at least ten dogs of the breed on the Imported Breed Register an application for the production of an Interim Breed Standard may be submitted for consideration by the Committee. Such application should include:

• A brief history of the dogs imported and registered.
• The size of the gene pool in the country.
• Any proposed breeding plan for the breed.

4. Breed Club registration
Supporters of a new imported breed will be encouraged to register a breed club which will be designated as a PROVISIONAL breed club. Only one per breed will be allowed and the club will only become fully registered if the breed is transferred from the Imported Breed Register to the Breed Register. Once a provisional breed club has been registered it may schedule one match competition per year but only as an internal club match or with another registered provisional breed club. The breeds eligible to compete would be only those breeds included within the title of the club(s) involved.

5. Transfer of a breed from the Imported Breed Register to the Breed Register
A breed will remain on the Imported Breed Register until it is considered sufficiently well established to move to the Breed Register. An application for transfer to the Breed Register would include:

• A brief history of the breed following its imported registration including an account of the number of dogs shown in Imported Register classes.
• The size of the gene pool and the available breeding lines in this country.

Kennel Club Regulation B3 defines the Imported Breed Register as follows:
The Imported Breed Register
a. The General Committee may accept for entry in the Imported Breed Register an imported dog of a previously unrecognised breed if the dog is imported from a country either having a Kennel Club with which there is a reciprocal agreement or which has full membership of the FCI or where there is a Breed Club maintaining a Stud Book and acceptable to The Kennel Club.
b. A breed given Imported Breed Register status may be transferred to the Breed Register at a later date at the discretion of the General Committee. Applications to transfer a breed from the Imported Breed Register to the Breed Register should be made to the General Committee by the appropriate Breed Club in accordance with the guidelines most recently published.
c. Foreign breeds, previously eligible for entry on the Breed Register will be transferred to the Imported Breed Register in accordance with Regulation B1b where there has been no registration activity for 10 years.
d. Breeds on the Imported Breed Register will be de-classified if there has been no registration activity within the breed over a ten year period.

NOTE:
It must be emphasised that only when a breed has been transferred to the Breed Register may dogs in the breed be entered in breed classes at shows.
If ten years elapse without any new registration on the Imported Breed Register the breed will be deleted from this register.

Czechoslovakian Wolfdog Club of Great Britain has been an established group since 2011

We thank ‘wolf dog.org’ for giving the club chance to reply to the remarks made here.

We would like to inform readers that this tread on Wolfdog.org is one sided and only the opinion from members of the other group. The members of http://www.vlcak.co.uk/ are in the main non owners of newly imported dogs for example Shadowlands , Rona and others are all breeders / wolf dog org moderators / admins.
The founders of http://www.vlcak.co.uk/ ;- Patryk [Hedeon], Layla[Tupacs2legs] , Hannah Crook [Tassle] , Chris Hind [Pixie] own non FCI and mixed dogs bought from UK Breeders such as Mr Winder/ Mr Collins’orkwolf’ /Andre Tanner/Lee Church and many other members don’t own any Czechoslovakian wolf dogs and have no experience of them.

This group http://www.vlcak.co.uk/ is a secret group and not open to all. We wonder why is this? and as far as our Club is concerned this group has no credibility .

If said members of http://www.vlcak.co.uk/ insist they are promoting the breed why would they not include all known new dogs to the UK, is this not bias ? Surely it would be a benefit to this group to include all newly imported dogs?

Wouldn’t it of been more beneficial to unite than to slander and mis inform readers.
Does this not make the group http://www.vlcak.co.uk/ look stupid and extremely unprofessional?

Czechoslovakian Wolfdog Club of Great Britain was formed by new owners of FCI registered / imported dogs and members interested in owning the breed in the future, Our Club is not managed/run/linked or owned by any established breeder in the UK.

The Club aims are to unite and then pursue Kennel Club Registration of Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs

The Club also aims to:

Promote the interests, welfare and responsible ownership of the Czechoslovakian Wolfdog in the United Kingdom, bring together owners and future breeders and facilitate the exchange of views and information on all subjects appertaining to the breed.

Keep a register of all litters eligible for registration until such time as the breed is recognised by the UK Kennel Club.

Keep accurate records of all health problems and temperament issues in the breed.

In addition to keeping a register of imported FCI registered Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs, necessary to obtain KC recognition, the Club is also keeping a register of UK bred dogs that will be eligible for KC registration once the breed has been recognised.

Our Club has a agreed Constitution and Code of Ethics and the Committee grows stronger every day.

We as a Club have more important roles to play in promoting pure breeding and development of Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs in the UK. We have no time or desire to troll the internet and discredit other groups on forums and social networks. Not like some members of http://www.vlcak.co.uk/ and wolf dog.org who purport themselves as guardians of the breed that troll the internet causing friction and have done zero to promote the breed only within secret societies, resulting only to discredit themselves as guardians.

Surely Admin and Moderators of this site should be clearer on facts before exasperating such a thread and misrepresenting our Club.

Wouldn’t it be more prudent for the wolf dog.org admin on this tread to give a unbias reply?

We hope this corrects the misrepresentation of our Club and of course welcome support from all members.

Good post Layla

So the only way to get a FCI registered dog is to import??

Yes. And when selecting the kennel and litter it would be wise to cooperate with other owners who are purchasing or going to get pups, so as to ensure diversification of lines.

At the same time the pups should come from typical and healthy parents, (unsuspected of having unpure ancestors) and the breeders who sell them should be willing to help the UK owners not only with providing advice and assistance, but also smartly seeing to the formalities. This is important to avoid breaking the FCI pedigree lines. Otherwise the situation from the past might repeat :(

FCI registered dog imports
 

Yes that's right if you want a FCI registerd puppy? then only imports from Ireland and Europe are registered as such. Fédération Cynologique Internationale (FCI) is an international federation of kennel clubs based in Belgium. The Fédération Cynologique Internationale has 84 member countries as of May 2008, with one member per country.Each member country regulates its own breed clubs and stud books, and trains its own judges; the FCI acts as an international coordinating body, making sure that pedigrees and judges are internationally recognized.In addition, the Fédération Cynologique Internationale sponsors and regulates the World Dog Show and international dog shows. The Fédération Cynologique Internationale is not affiliated with the UK but is recognized and accepted.

Problem is the UK KC does not accept all registered FCI breeds!

Great!!! If need a help only say.

I'm not really interested in breeding or showing - I just want a happy healthy puppy that is a great example of the breed.

Great work!!!! :)

Then I would just contact a breeder whoms dogs you admire and are health tested. The good thing is we no longer have quarantine in the UK making things so much simpler
:lol:

That is a great attitude Murph :) Do your research on breeders, check out their lines and dogs and find someone you like and trust. You should always be able to get contacts of previous owners from a breeder so that you can check out what their 'post sales service' has been like too. Beware of breeders who don't offer you a lifetime support - they are the ones not interested in the puppy, just the colour of your money :(

I understand you perfectly because that was my only concern too.

However in the specific situation of the breed in the UK any imported pup could apart from being "happy healthy example of the breed" also contribute to the breed registration. Why not use such a great opportunity.

Besides, vlcaks vary a lot one from another. It matters what looks and especially characters the parents of a particular litter have :| Some owners prefer active pups with strong personalities for sport and work, others might prefer pups of less independent parents. For one person big coat and small ears are important, for another - light body and good movement. Etc. etc. Some research into the breed before getting a dog is really advisable.

I have been planning on getting a CsV for several years so have researched all I can. One thing I haven't done is researched Europesn breeders as I didn't regard importing as an option with older quarantine laws.

If the breeder bothers to care for intensive early socialisation it's not problem to get a really nice 15 week-old baby vlcak from FCI country now :)
Good luck in your search :)

I agree with this! We just picked up 2 15-week'ish old puppies from Europe.. they are happy, outgoing, self assured.. and nearly housebroken.. ;-) next time I get a puppy, I will pick her up at this age too.. because the 10-15 week period for my first CSV was terrible.. :lol::lol:

Of course provided your breeder socializes them and not just keep them in a kennel somewhere!

If you will deicide to make your plans happen and you will go for FCI registered dog, please, let us know. As you aware, we need 20 unrelated dogs with FCI pedigrees. If you think you could do something more for the breed in here, join our little club :)

clubs
 

I just tried to visit your clubs web page but it was closed? it's a shame that there is already a divide in clubs and wouldn't it be better if you guys unite?
This will improve the chance of the breed getting recognition with the UK kennel club.

In an ideal world, think everybody would love to be able to unite and fight for recognition together. but the problem is that the Czechoslovakian Wolfdog Club GB has been founded and run by breeders who have used the CsV to create mixes to line their own pockets rather than to flourish and establish the breed here in the UK. how can the Czechoslovakian Vlcak Club of UK, which is made up of people who are trying to protect the CsV and encourage pure breeding through trusted lines, agree with the practice of breeding mixes?

Yes Soul, it would be better. See my reply http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showthread.php?t=21819

But thing is, CSV club can not be managed by people who brought this breed in this country to brink of destruction. Because of these breeders UK was banned for export by European breeders. How you want to make them to trust us if among us will be the same people who caused whole mess? And to have proper breeding in UK, we need to cooperate with quality breeders from Europe.

Can someone please clarify the differences between these two clubs?!!!
Who founded each?
Have they both got websites and forums?!?

I am going to get a CsV as soon as a suitable litter is available. I am not however going to partake in politics around the breed. All I am interested in is a companion

The diference is that one club is really trying to help the breed in UK, while the other club is a "desperate try" made by UK puppy millers to avoid the formation of a real and right club of the breed in UK.
If there is a club working for help and selecting the breed, the puppy millers will have real problems, before UK was a real paradise for puppy millers willing to mistake people with the talk of "CzW are agressive, mixes are better" or "there are no CzW in UK than ours mixes", but now, with new rules for import dogs, to import a CzW is much easier and these puppy millers are for lost their market.
If you wish information, contact the http://www.vlcak.co.uk/ its the right club with no "hidden interest".
You can be sure that wolfdog club GB is not a serious club only by looking its reactions at this forum, completely childish reaction.

Same as me. Really. But if you dig deeper you will start to see whole picture. You will understand that someone has to get involved, even if doesn't like to. You will understand that if you will not do anything one day CSV will end up on list of banned breeds in UK. Only because some breeder whose main concern was money, didn't ask right questions when selling his puppy, and later dog bitten someone, cause his owner is real moron, who bought this dog for its scary, wolfish look. What you gonna do with your dog when it is going to be illegal to have one? Murph, not asking you to join us. Look around, talk to people, read old post here, and find out why breeders from Europe banned UK from sending puppies. Make your own mind...

I would like to respond, if you excuse me my english... Hope I will be able to post it.You getting things a little mixed up here, but there is no point in correcting them. Yes, I don't own CSV yet, and others may not own FCI registered dogs, but this does't stop us from seeing difference between pure, ethical breeding and breeding only for profit, with what ever you can get.

Here I would like to straighten one thing up: vlcak.co.uk is accentually no group. It is just website (still under construction) which is aiming to promote the breed, give some basic info about the breed, and most importantly, make people aware of problems these dogs encountered in UK. Make aware of cross-breeding and puppy mass production for sake of money only. To state that in this moment there is no ethical, pure breeding in UK, and if someone wants CSV has to look overseas. If you check this website closely, you will find tere is no mention of club anywhere.

Now about our closed group on Facebook. This group was created mostly for purposes of discussion, regarding matters of stopping unethical breeding, preventing puppy millers (Ork wolf in this case) from causing more damage to the dogs, and breed in this country. For obvious reasons it cold not be public, as we didn't wanted these breeders to access these discussions. Yes, it meant to be a seed of Club as well but we didn't rushed with it, as for this moment there is very little FCI registered dogs in UK (some are owned by Ork Wolf but, we are strongly against his way of breeding). In fact, first official sign on creation of the club is here: http://www.wolfdog.org/forum/showthread.php?t=21839 where we would like to invite every one to join.


Who told you we would not? Is it assumption? Or just a try to discredit? We need as many as possible FCI dogs, same as you. If someone is happy to cooperate, will just make us happy too. But you maybe have in mind we did not invite Ork Wolf to cooperation. Well, he maybe owns FCI CSV but he also represents everything what we trying to fight with. Breeders like him brought CSV to place where they are in this country.

And saying somebody "looks stupid" makes you extremely professional? Come one, you can do better than that :)
Unite would be a great thing. But... If I am well told co founders of your group are people like Paul Collins, Hanka, and Sansorella. Two of them are people responsible for destroying this breed in UK. Their actions caused UK to be banned from exporting to. For many years they have cross breed, no even thinking about recognition with UK Kennel Club. There was no need. It was nearly impossible to import puppies from Europe, so they could do whatever they wanted. Registration with Kennel Club would only put restrictions and regulations on them, so why to do it if puppy business is going so well? Recent change in DEFRA law (Department for Environment, Food And Rural Affairs) makes now importing dogs from Europe much, much easier. Now, all these cross breeders have to compete with European breeders. That is no good for business... And these European breed dogs have something UK breed dogs have not - pedigrees. So now change of mind, and they going for recognition - hence, your club.

But is managed by a breeder from Czech :) Don't forget we saw it on screen shots :) If you are all new owners, not breeders, you didn't know each other before. Just wonder, how you guys have meet up, organised? This is biggest forum about CSV. Every day, I am reading this and other forums, facebook group, and nowhere no one mentions importing CSV. Just Ork Wolf. How you have promoted your forum, in such short time? There must be some central point, and I bet it is Ork Wolf - Hanka Ltd. :D How it comes Hanka who sold puppies to Ork Wolf is one of you moderators/admins? How she becomes in such short time one of persons who deicide what is right or what is wrong on the forum? Don't blame me, but conclusions are pretty obvious. So dont tell me you are just owners, unrelated to current breeders ....

In conclusion - I would be very happy to team up with your club, only if I could see it being right. Without Hanka, ork wolf, sansorella , and others UK cross breeders, and puppy millers. Those breeders should never get registered with Kennel Club as breeders. Excluded form development of this breed in this country. But it will never happen, isn't it?

Congratulations for your great work in the UK :)
And, I really like your web site! :thumbs

Hi Hedeon,
I don´t know you, you don´t know me...Can you write me why you give me together with some croses?
Thanks for answer.
Hanka

Hi All,

New to the forum, I followed the link from the website.
Although it looks like i had joined this forum a long time ago.
I hope we can get this majestic breed recognised in the uk.
I would like to know from anyone who has imported a puppy to the uk.
I was just looking for an idea of cost to import , from which country.

[quote=Hanka;424124]Hi Hedeon,
I don´t know you, you don´t know me...Can you write me why you give me together with some croses?
Thanks for answer.
Hanka


You are right. For some time I was convinced that one of your pups landed up in OrkWolf Kennel in UK, despite of warnings about this breeder in Czech forum. If it is not true, then I do apologise Hanka.

Ok, thank you.

Hi Obbie, and welcome.

Thing is it is not easy to tell straight how much it's gonna cost you, beside of fact matter of money should not be your first concern when thinking about importing CSV. But there is how it looks like more or less:

money your breeder will ask for puppy - different from breeder to breeder, country to country. Note that your dog will have to stay with a breeder additional 7 weeks more than a pup which is going to stay local. Also additional veterinary care must be taken.

+

cost of transport. what is distance to travel? Are you taking a plane, or car? Maybe train? I personally would not trust very much to breeder who offers to me posting a pup to UK. Obvious reasons. Also, every respectable breeder will want to meet you in person at least once.

+

Cost of stay. You may stay there few days, you may need hotel room, or some food. Maybe breeder can offer to you to stay at his place for day or two. Again, talk to breeder.


I can only tell you that in my case it is around 700-800 pounds with trip to Poland. Your can be different. Most importantly, it will be less than a price you will have to pay for a possibly cross with no FCI papers in UK.

Stay here, look for a while. On main page you can see incoming litters. If you want advice, or by getting yourself a CSV you will like to help our cause we may suggest something. If we want to establish proper population of CSV in UK, we will need many different, quality lines. I, personally, don't know much about breeding and genetics, but can contact you with someone who does.

Hi Obbie, if you wish, I give you contact to my UK owners of pups. Write me.

hi obbie :)

as said, preferably many new lines are needed in the couuntry,but even if that is not your priority i would take your time,talk to many breeders(hopefully home bred rather than large kennels)learn the lines and types which there are a couple,u wouldnt want a high energy csv if u do not plan to train in any competetive disciplines etc,the standard price for a healthtested vlcak should be around the same price wherever but extra costs incurred whilst being held by the breeder may vary,as will the exporting depending on the mode of transport etc...a good breeder will discuss this with u,dont be scared of asking them many questions,and dont be surprised that they ask many of u(which a good breeder will)

[quote=Hanka;424270]Hi Obbie, if you wish, I give you contact to my UK owners of pups. Write me.


advert hanka? :roll:

we(as in the uk) need varied lines as i would imagine even u know :)

Are you going to put information up on the vicakuk website about lines and genetic diversity in the CsV ?
I would guess most people considering a CsV would not even know where to start when thinking about importing

If I would have such article it would definitely go to site. But I know very little about this things, so I can't write it myself. What I meant in post above was more about avoiding to import of close relatives, CSV gene pool is very small.

This is maybe a good idea of writing something more about whole process. Thanks Murph

Hi Obbie
I am new to the forum as well, I imported a pup from the EU last month and I am going to collect one next month as a companion, I have researched this breed since 2008, It would be a good idea to do as much research as you can. Just rember it can be very traumatic for a pup to travel such a long way in one go so planning is key.
pm me if you want more info

Wow, congratulations!!! Could you tell us what dog you've imported?
I guess it'll be important for further UK owners to know which lines are already represented in the UK ...8)

the bit in bold confuddled me :) what was the first pup if the second is to be a companion?

Thank you all for the information.
Money is not my main concern but it would be the first stumbling block, and being able to plan for this would be great.
I was looking for a general sum, preferable from people who had done this before.
The kind of example would be:
I got a puppy from Germany and I transported the pup back on a train and it cost about £500.
I was not looking for exact costs from each breeder.
I understand that costs would be higher to get a dog imported into the UK, I was just looking for a general figure.
Thank you for the offer Hanka, but I would not like to waste your time as I would be unable to import a pup this year.
My current dog has not completed her training, so currently would not have time give a new pup.
I’m currently trying to get to know everyone and understand the full situation in the UK and Europe.
I will continue to read this site with interest, and hope I can become an active member :lol:

Great attitude Obbie :)

Maybe as people import more pups, there will be a bit more info on the costs involved (over and above the purchase of the puppy) :) It's the kind of information that is good to share as it will help people like you in the future.

One thing I have noticed is that the ferry companies seem to be cashing in on these new relaxed import regulations :( 4 years ago, we brought 2 cats out of the UK - there was no charge for them on the ferry as they had to stay in the vehicle (Dover-Dunkirk, a very quick crossing). I looked up the same crossing and now they are quoting about £30 per animal - and they still have to stay in the vehicle!! Grrrrrr :anger

Companion for the first puppy I presume

No she already has 3 other dogs, these 2 were bought purely for breeding thats why she got 2 unrelated pups getting the female first, if it was just for companionship she could of got 2 from the same litter, and had them spayed,

When I asked her I was told that when i was looking for another dog to ask the breeders if they had exported to UK before, and refused to tell me who were the breeders

Really? What transparent approach! :twisted: I wonder why so secretive? :? Aranwen seems proud of his new pup and puts Marron's photos on FB! So are Nebulosa, Amanda, Marcy, Yukomari, her sister, Jonatan from Spain, Italian & French owners, and many, many owners who imported vlcaks from central Europe!

I thought the new regulations would enable British owners come with their dogs to various vlcak meetings, camps, shows, participate in exams, endurance runs and bonitations. If Spanish, German, Dutch , French owners/breeders can participate, why couldn't the British ones? I thought the 'new owners' from the UK intended to become part of the international vlcak community, share their joys and problems with others, but I doubt if this is possible with "anonymous" dogs.:p

Wolfheart, here, on the continent we are proud of our vlcaks and of their kennels names. (Even if they are not perfect ;-)) Aren't you? Anyway, I still hope to get an answer from you :)

Hello forum
As a new member I thought I would give it a whirl and say hello. I had been a guest seen your reactions to members and did I did think twice. Its a shame that you go directly on a offensive, although I don’t know the history of why you treat new members with this manner.
I wasn’t sure if it was correct to disclose your dogs names as I am new to the forum .
What ever happened to friendly warm welcome ?
I have research this breed, visited many owners in Europe and adored this dog since I was a boy.
I am not a ‘breeder’ but a devoted and thrilled owner who is determined to do the best for the breed with either of the ‘provisional clubs’.
It wouldn’t benefit the breed if I had bought 2 dogs and had them spayed and as a caring owner my first plan would be to learn, show and become involved with clubs to promote the breed and my dogs. I attend training classes, I plan to spend time in Europe with my dogs visiting events/shows and learning from other owners how to get the best out of my dogs.
‘breeding’ dogs is not my priority especially if they are not recognised in the UK Breeding two FCI dogs will not produce FCI puppies therefore I would only be adding to the problem we have here in the UK It would not help the breed.
I have joined the other club and as an open minded owner I felt it would be a great idea to check out both before making a plan. Although your warm supportive welcome is perhaps lacking here. In my honest opinion.
Its worth remembering other new owners are being directed here from your website and I would advise you collectively get your ‘house in order’ as not to put off genuine interested new owners and prospective ones. Your actions here are most important and a reflection of your club. If you want high regard then you really should show more care to your manner towards new members.
I wont enter into a online debate I don’t have the time and hardly online.
I am clear on my goals for my dogs and the hard work devotion I have to now face with great enthusiasum to train develop and work to promote the breed.
Enjoy your day mine is full of socialising, walking and enjoying my puppy!

Do you call offensive my congratulations on you getting a new pup or the question about its name?:?

It's hard to belive that somebody who has "research this breed, visited many owners in Europe" has not come accross this site and this forum. And if you have, then you'd know it was correct to disclose your dogs names and proudly put them in the profile under the section "about me" :)

Anyway, despite my doubts and reservations, I honestly wish you good luck with your pup and hope it'll grow to a fantastic dog and great friend of yours.

I agree
 

I would like to wish you good luck with your new dogs and agree, while reading all these comments, it does put you off . My advice is '' don't get involved with breed politics '' enjoy your dogs for what they are no matter who bred them

Hi Wolfheart,
I'm a new member also and understand what you’re saying.
However, if you look back through threads on this forum, or put the breed into a GOOGLE search you will see why people on here act this way.
I find the comments are less offensive/aggressive and more suspicious and protective.
Looking at past threads and links I can see why breeders on here will look at new owners (particularly from the UK) with suspicion, and I see it as justified.
But you should never be embarrassed about your dogs, they wouldn’t be embarrassed of you
(I think mine was once though when she refused an agility jump, so I jumped it and said look it’s not that hard)

Exactly! :cool3

Like it! :lol:
Obbie, IMO vlcak is definitely the right breed for you! 8)

Thank you very much :) We are really trying get this breed to UK, and do it in a way it is intended to. What I want to say: responsible, honest, ethical breeding and owning. In full cooperation with European quality breeders, and people of this forum. But our efforts are not unnoticed by those who previously abused this breed, and have placed it in position it is in now. Most of them doesn't like what this club is trying to achieve. Some of them are trying to stop us this or other way, some are threatening us, some are discrediting this club, others are trying others tactics. If you call our efforts to defend from it, or defend a breed from people who can cause further damage, a "breed politics" that's fine :( .... But please, you have to understand, not every one who comes to this forum is a person who he is saying he is. And not everyone posting here is honest person. :( So, please, don't get offended if your welcoming is not as warm as you imagined it. It is difficult for us too, and we are sorry.... But we need your help, we need honest people who want to help us build this club and finally, establish CSV in UK for good. This club, right now, is just forming, and there is a lot of work to do. We can not carry on without honest people who really care about welfare of vlcaks, even if they don't own one yet.
Excuse me my english.

First of all let me say i wish you well with your 2 wonderful dogs, I hope you give them all they deserve, but I must pull you up on a couple of points, firstly i never asked you on this forum i asked you on the forum that you helped set up about the breeders of your dogs, so it was nothing to do with this forum secondly you state that your not a breeder but having your dogs spayed would not be beneficial to the breed, if you have no intention of breeding them what is the problem with having them spayed and what benefit are they to the breed if they are only your pets, thirdly you state you were getting a second dog as a companion but you have other dogs, its not wrong to get another dog but the reasons should be clear and finally you say you have no intention of getting involved in the politics of the breed in my opinion is a cop out, as we must all get involved in the politics of the breed to make sure they are looked after in this country and no longer abused for fiscal reasons. Can I also add there is nothing wrong with breeding dogs and selling them nearly everybody who breeds dogs sells them its if the selling is the main reason for breeding that it is morally wrong just my opinion

Also are you not an admin on one of the 2 provisional clubs

Hello Rona,

I agree with you, I live in France and have two FCC and FCi registered dogs. An enormous sociable grey wide built male sociable with a dog like manner and good worker and on the other side a slighter finer browner coloured female with good mouvement but less inclined to be a good worker and a bit more timide.